Utah Sucks

Utah has to be the shittiest place to live if you’re not a member of the Mormon church. The state itself is wonderful, but the people suck. Not only are most people here extremely stupid, they are bigoted and closed-minded toward any people or ideas that are not of LDS origin. Springville recently passed an ordinance that allows the sale of beer on Sunday. This just points out how fucked up most of the rest of the state is by not allowing for beer sales on Sunday, but if you read the sign in the picture in that article, you can see just how illiterate Utahns are–”We Sale Beer on Sunday.”

I still don’t understand how the state’s lawmakers can get away with passing and maintaining laws that prohibit alcohol sales on Sunday, or laws that prohibit premarital sex and other sexual acts between married couples. Those can only be considered religious issues–I don’t know any atheists who give a shit about what other people do behind closed doors. There is absolutely no separation between church and state in Utah.

Here are a couple more articles detailing how fucked up Utah is:
54-year-old single police chief warned about premarital sex by city officials
BYU suspends gay student for dating

01/02/2014 Update: I was in my mid-20s when I originally wrote this post. I’m now creeping up on 40, and while my feelings haven’t changed regarding “morality” being forced upon others by the majority religion in this state, the harshness of my words was certainly unwarranted. In particular, I regret calling people stupid. This post from almost six years ago sums up how I still feel now: Utah is a great place to live if you can manage to not get too worked up over the few asinine things that the state’s lawmakers try to force on the minority non-LDS population.

161 thoughts on “Utah Sucks

    1. Fuck the lds church!! They say they are Christians?? Right!! They have sold their souls to the devil including their si called “profit” Joseph smith himself!! G
      What a crock!!! Organized religion is a sham…made up laws to suit the MAN!! I spit on all of you!!

      1. I love living in Utah. We moved here from San Diego four years ago. We have several Mormons neighbors. Very kind and helpful. They have never pressured us in any way to join their faith, but they have become close friends.
        I would rather live here any day over California. Sorry, you hate it so. I do not love the cold weather, but that is my only complaint. Why don’t you move? If living here is that miserable, I would get out ASAP.

  1. Hey I live in Utah, and yes you are sooo fucking right! I hate the damn mormons, and I wish they would just open their minds, and get a hint of the real world. I also think its bullshit that they dont sale beer on sundays. I dont know any mormons who drink beer, so they shouldn’t even give a shit about it!

  2. Northern Utah sucks for an older single guy. The vast majority of smart, intelligent, and/or career-oriented women don’t stay in a place where they are expected to be barefoot and pregnant during all of their childbearing years.
    The Salt Lake Valley is the most polluted place I have ever lived. Air pollution is a sacred cow in Utah. When we have the worst air pollution in the country, the TV anchorman asks the weatherman “When’s this fog gonna clear?” When I was a kid in Wisconsin, we learned to separate green glass from brown glass from clear glass and also save newspapers, metal, and plastic containers for recycling. In Utah they take environmentally challenged children and give them a tour of the Davis County Garbage Burning Facility, which burns 420 tons of garbage a day. Davis County used to hire “Garbage Police” to spy on construction workers to make sure they take their garbage to the Garbage Burning Facility and not to a dump. Common Utah myths include: diesel vehicles pollute less than gasoline (they can’t even admit the obvious), more pollution in the Salt Lake Valley is caused naturally than by man, the winter inversion layer occurs naturally (true) including the pollution caught in it (false) so there is nothing you can do about it (false), if it meets government standards it’s safe to breathe the air (cigarettes meet government standards), garbage burning is recycling, auto companies can’t make vehicles that pollute less, recycling isn’t cost effective, and it isn’t cost effective to make the refineries pollute less (true for the Huntsman Cancer Institute).
    Utah has the highest bankruptcy rate in the nation. Gambling is illegal in Utah, but it’s legal for a PayDay LoanSharkto charge 444% interest on loans. It’s legal to take someone who is on the edge financially, who really needs counseling, and shove him over the edge just so a few corrupt people can make money at the expense of everybody else (that’s right, everyone pays for it when someone goes bankrupt). At least in a casino, the casino pays taxes and some people walk out a winner. No customer has ever walked out a winner from one of those PayDay LoanShark places.
    Most Mormons I have met are very nice. Unfortunately, that makes it easy for bad people to get away with things because they are less likely to be confronted by very nice people. This is the same problem the Muslims have now, after many years of ignoring hate schools and not confronting it. The fact that the LDS Church keeps them so busy does not give Mormons much time to be activists against corruption. As a result, their are many corrupt people in high places in Utah who act like they don’t believe in any higher authority, federal or otherwise. I say they are merely using the Mormon faith for a legitimate front.
    In Ogden there is an asphalt plant right next to homes. In homes within several blocks of the plant, about 25% of residents have had cancer and/or respiratory disease. Despite the fact that some states don’t allow an asphalt plant within a 1/2 mile of residences, OgdenCity decided to do a study. That was the last I heard of the issue. The Mormon Faith preaches “being honest with your fellow man” and “living a healthy lifestyle.” This is one of many examples of people in charge who are using the LDS Faith for a legitimate front.
    The Utah Legislature, voted with their campaign finance pocketbooks in favor of banks, and made new rules to thwart credit unions. The banks (who make high-risk oversears investments and get bailed out by taxpayers when they tank) can’t compete with nonprofit credit unions who keep the money in the local community. The credit unions then went to a federal charter, and as a result, Utah is out millions in tax revenue.
    After former Utah Gov Leavitt headed up the EPA, a list was made of areas that need to clean up the air under federal mandates. That list didn’t include Utah, because they used an average air quality (winter and summer) for the years 2000 through 2002, neglecting more recent data including January 2004 when pollution was “Red” most of the month somewhere in Utah. Also the EPA rating for “Green” (good) air quality level went from below 50 ppm to below 60 ppm.
    After Utah government scientists reported that the Guv’s family fish farm operated withour the proper license and contributed to the spread of Whirling Disease, there was a major reorganization that purged or demoted the scientists.
    OgdenCity is spending your tax dollar and using emminent domain to move out 8 businesses and 30 homes to make way for a new WalMart. WalMart will get a construction loan that will be paid back over the next 5 years with it’s tax receipts. That’s right, for 5 years WalMart effectively won’t pay taxes. Meanwhile, there isn’t enough money to give police officers and firemen the raise they were promised under contract, it’s hard to get the attention of building inspectors because they have too many pots boiling over, and there will be a net loss in revenue because WalMart competes against other businesses that pay taxes. If the OgdenCity mayor and City Counsel didn’t take a bribe on this, then they are stupider than hell for doing it for nothing! I don’t see the mayor winning the next election. Everyone I talked to is against using emminent domain this way. This is another example of someone who is using the LDS Faith for a legitimate front.
    Then there was the Legacy Highway fiasco, in which, at the request of the contractor, Utah officials included a clause in the highway construction contract to pay the contractor $92,000 a day for doing nothing if the project was stopped for environmental reasons. After Utah officials didn’t do their Environmental Impact Study right, the project was stopped. The State of Utah sued the Sierra Club for stopping the project, and wanted the Sierra Club to pay all Utah’s costs, but a federal judge said the majority of Utah’s costs were self-inflicted.
    Utah’s sexual assualt statistics are among the highest in the nation, but most northern Utahn’s believe a sexual assault is a very rare thing and dismiss anyone who disagrees. (ignorance is bliss)
    Utah consistantly ranks among the highest toxic polluting states in the nation. In 2001, about 107 million pounds of lead was put into the air, land, and water. This may explain some comments from others on this website about Utahns being dumb or closed-minded. When I first came here I thought their dumbness was the result of many years of inbreeding.
    If you are female and are thinking about taking a job at Utah State University, you may want to reconsider. A recent study concluded that professional women at USU make $12,891 less on average than men in the same jobs with the same years of experience. Recent budget cuts aren’t expected to fix this.
    If you want to go to college, and would also like to have a beer party sometime, don’t consider BYU. When comparing 357 Colleges recently on many topics, BYU was dead last on the list of best places to party.
    If you like beer, and I mean good beer, you have to go to a State Liquor Store which isn’t open on Sundays. You can buy 3.2% crap at the convenience stores and supermarkets. Unfortunately, the State Liquor Stores do not refrigerate their beer, and on Sunday, they turn off the airconditioner (I asked an employee about this). In th Summer beer cooks at 100 degrees on Sunday. I have poored many beers down the drain that went bad. Only the best German beers consistently stand up to Utah Handling & Storage Procedures for beer.
    If you are a normal person who likes going to nightclubs and sportsbars to watch sports, dance, and have a few beers, then you’ll be in the middle of a desert in northern Utah. Most of the people in bars in Ogden either hate Mormons and wear that on their sleeves, or are part of the criminal element. There isn’t much in between. If you are normal you will be in the minority. In other places I’ve lived, the local sportsbar has almost every game in the nation on TV. When I walk in the bartender turns on my game and gets me a menu. There isn’t any sportsbar like that north of Salt Lake City. The first time I went to a sportsbar on a football Saturday in Ogden there were only 3 other customers there. This so-called sportsbar only had the same TV channels that I had at home on expanded basic cable. People will make smalltalk about illegal drugs just to see your reaction (i.e., will you do drugs with me?). If you let them know you don’t do illegal drugs for career reasons, they disappear when you go to the bathroom. In one bar, someone came in who the other bartenders hadn’t seen in a while – they acted like best of friends. That person had just gotten out of jail and was later yelling at someone on his cellphone saying “Come on, you have to party with me tonight. This is my only chance to get fucked up.” Meanwhile, the bartenders were continuing to serve strong mixed drinks to two people who were well past their limit, despite having knowledge that they were driving home.
    Although Utahns pride themselves on good, clean living and low crime, Utah has one of the highest ratest for burglary, larceny, and theft. Utah is the only place where I’ve been burglarized.
    Most Mormons are very nice people. They donate a tremendous amount of time and money to charity, in order to help people who are on the edge of control in life. For example, Deseret Industries helps people who have work-related deficiencies, and brings them along until they have the skills and confidence to get a job on their own. It’s hard to measure what that’s worth, but I must give credit where it’s due. If they are serious Mormons, they won’t have much time to socialize with non-Mormons. The Church is very slowly changing it’s old ways, which were borne out of reasonable fear of the outside world in the mid-1800s. These changes are happening so slowly that I will be dead before the Mormom Church changes enough for me. My hiking buddy grew up Mormom and is still officially on the books, but does not really participate. He would rather go hiking on Sunday and he does drink beer. He says you are not really free if you have someone telling you to do all the time. Although most Mormons are very nice, one thing I’m getting tired of hearing is being asked why I’m not Mormon – definitely too much empasis on recruitment. If the world ends tomorrow, I’ll be no worse off because they couldn’t recruit me.
    If you want to go back to the attitudes of the 1950s, come to Utah, otherwise, coming here would likely be the biggest mistake of your life.
    Jeff

  3. You guys have way too much time on your hands to bitch about Utah. Most of the utah people come here to Wyoming to get their beer and acholol. Utah is my home town and I have nothing bad to say about it. So stop your bitching!!!!!!

  4. I’m LDS, but Utah would be the last place on earth I would move to. Most of the mormons there are hypocrites. You have to leave Utah to see how true mormonism is practiced. Those idiots give our religion a bad name…

    1. I’ve heard that. I’m a Catholic from Philadelphia and any and all Mormon’s I’ve met outside of Utah seemed like relatively normal people, just practitioners of a non-Trinitarian Christian sect. The people around here despise Catholics and the Catholic Church. I have dark hair and lean features, but not Latino, so I’m constantly asked if I’m Muslim, Jewish, Asian, etc. For a religion that propounds good manners and decency to one’s fellow man, it’s mighty thin on the ground around here.

  5. Utah is a great place to live. As for you staying out that will be fine . the less of you narrow minded bastards I have to deal with the better.
    PS Fuck you and your web site

  6. Wow…maybe you should work out your own issues before dissing me and my website. For anyone interested, the above anonymous comment (dated 5/11/2005 at 2:25 pm) was posted by the following:
    IP Address: 207.173.208.250
    Referring URL:
    http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?FORM=MSNH&srch_type=0&q=sex+buddy+utah
    Notes: The computer at this IP address (207.173.208.250) runs a web server for Sabol & Rice, Inc. Their address and phone number are 1834 South 900 West, Salt Lake City, UT 84104, Phone: 801-973-2300, Fax#: 801-972-5033. Various email addresses for employees of this company can be found at http://207.173.208.250/sabweb/contct.html

  7. I have lived in Utah for my entire life and it is starting to really get on my nerves. My life experience in Utah has show me that a lot of Mormons are hypocrite

  8. I lived in utah off and on for 16 years against my will of course because utah is the gayest ass place to live..i have hated mormons since i could remember have beat up as many as them as i possibly could. I grew up in Ogden Layton and Roy, I finally got out for good and i am in California now, in layton and further down south there is a lds church on every single fuckin block, the laws are so fucked you cant even celebrate the 4th of july on the 4th of july if it falls on a sunday…..fuckin mormons! i am filled with extreme hate towards mormons and would kill them all if i could! ahah

  9. When I lived in Texas, I would often see a bumper sticker that read: “I wasn’t born in Texas, but I got here as quickly as I could.” The other day driving along North Temple in SLC, I saw one that read: “I’m not from Utah; I just can’t get out.” My sentiments exactly. Moving to Utah was indeed the biggest mistake of my life.

    1. I want that bumper sticker! I have lived here for 8 years now and it has not been a positive experience. My wife is from here and I got her out of the Mormon church. She now has an understanding that Jesus Christ is real. Mormons use the same words as Christians, but they have COMPLETELY different meanings. Utah is an awesome place to visit: skiing, mountain trails and is a rockhound’s dream. BUT and it is a big BUT- living and working here is COMPLETELY different. I
      I moved here to start the design department for a large Architectural firm in SLC. Then I decided to get involved locally with design and work for a local firm. In a nutshell, I was set up to fail. Most all of the other designers came from the design school at BYU’s Idaho campus. This four letter firm does a lot of the temple work for the Mormon church. If you do not join the hive, they WILL waste no time stabbing you in the back and killing your career!
      Do research on at the Nauvoo temple’s round clearstory windows. They are inverted pentagrams!!! I kid you not!!! I want out of Utah—-if that is what God’s will is for me, or stay here and fight and get these people out of this DAMN cult!!!

  10. I live in utah and im not mormon and everything is true. bunch o’ bastards. I’m so glad I’m moving to california next year! :)

  11. I think Jeff hit the nail on the head in a so many areas. I would also like to note how next to every public school is an LDS church. I find this appalling. When telling my sister about this she reminded me that the high school we went to in Fountain Valley, CA had an LDS church.
    Frightening. I am wondering if this practice of placing their churches next to schools goes on throughout this country. Of course, it is more evident here in Utah, I just wonder about other states where this goes on unnoticed.
    I can’t wait to get out of here. I have worked with the public in California, Georgia, Mississippi and Utah has definitely won the low level intelligence award.
    For such a beautiful state, it is filled with a creepy energy. I personally believe that the mormon religion is one of satan’s greatest tricks.

    1. They are yoked to Lucifer, as in their in their temple ceremonies- this is why they put on the apron! Yes, absolutely true that all of the public schools have a “seminary” building adjacent to the school property. This is also a way to weed out the kids who are not LDS……ain’t it great!!!
      The energy that I feel here is OPPRESSIVE!!!

  12. I used to live in Layton and I must say it sucked. The high school that I went too for two years and graduated from was filled with the most ignorant people I’ve ever met in my life. My teachers would actually kick me out of my classroom because I wasn’t Mormon and “knew too much for my own damn good.” I never found out what I knew too much about, perhaps I knew too much of the outside world, I guess I’ll never know.
    Utah does have a wonderful landscape and snow-caped mountains most of the time. But looks aren’t everything, I was so happy when I found out I was moving.

  13. You fucking mormon hypocrites… shame shame mormons arn’t suppost to curse you dumb ass fuckers… I LIVE IN UTAH and a can’t scratch my ass without seeing a mormon church on the corner. Like Walmart they are planning on taking over the world. Now I’m not a big fan of hitler but maybe he was on the right track, oxymormonism should die!!! They take the young inocent children push them under the water and tell them that they are mormon. AND what with the coke! A thought you people couldn’t drike soda! Why do you own it. FUCKING HYPOCRITES!!

  14. I was raised by a Mormon family, practiced the religion until I was 30, then the light turned on, mormonism isn’t true, it’s all a brain wash! What right minded person would wear so called “garments”, trust me it wont protect you from a stray bullet. Utah is tolerable now since I left the flock, now when I see the Goddy mormons go to church I have to laugh. Someday they will see the light, how can they, they are so blinded by truth, ask any mormon about Mark Hoffman.

  15. Hey ! it’s not exacly true!!!! I am a mormon !!! and utah Still SUCKS !!!! even more, nothing to do in here and news, music doesn’t get here ! and if it does with a few years of delay -linkin park “from the inside” is here considered as new hit!!! hhe he he!!!

  16. I LIVED IN UTAH FOR ONLY 11 MONTHS!!!. I got a great job paying me 40 thousand a year. i quit the job to come back to texas (the greatest state in this country besides california or new york) to live with my parents and be unemployed!!! thats how bad it was there. Everyone there is a religious nut job. (i vote republican by the way) i swear to god, mormans are just white muslims, there’s something about living in a desert that makes people go insane. I have never met so many people on welfare as i did in salt lake city. i had never seen so many poor white people in my life. most people i met were highschool dropouts and everyone out there was on crystal meth too!!!!!!!! I saw almost no minorities there, and of the ones who did live there, they were all brought in by morman converts and were usually from nigeria and spoke no english. The pollution was bad, i thought mountain air was supposted to be clean…HOUSTON HAD LESS AIR POLLUTION!!!!! Every week on the news i heard about a womans body being found in the dumpster, and in almost all cases it was her husband who killed her. incest was rampant, i met several girls who had been molested by their own fathers!!! poligimy was a debatable issue umunst even educated people there. most people got married by the time they were 17, most 20 year old chicks had 3 kids…i couldnt find a decent girl to date in the whole damn city. I swear to god, the USA only has 49 states….50 if you count puerto rico. IM A PROUD TEXAN AND HAVE NEVER BEEN SO HAPPY TO BE BACK IN HOUSTON TRAFFIC IN MY LIFE!!!!!!!!! utah was NOT worth 40,000$ a year, ud have to pay me at least 500k to make me move back to that salt lame city (but the natural beauty out there is so awesome, its such a shame normal people cant go there)

    1. I have never appreciated my little southern state like I did when I returned there after making haste from that deplorable state. When we finally crossed back into Texas on our way home I felt like this dark cloud of despair had been lifted off of me. Utah is evil. It is filled with evil people and even worse pollution. Utah shouldn’t even be considered part of the United States. Seriously. Let the Mormons have it. They don’t want you there if you aren’t Mormon anyway. Your only chance of having a half way decent life in Utah is if you convert, otherwise be prepared for hell on earth. It’s like a completely different planet.

    2. I’m a Salt Lake City resident. Moved here about four years ago from Philadelphia. Never in my life have I had a harder time holding a job, getting back into college, finding a decent apartment, navigating the culture. It is seriously weird here.
      I figured a guy from Texas would find it easier to assimilate to the Western culture than a guy from the East Coast. I’m glad someone from another Western-ish state has the same difficulties.
      You’re absolutely right…I do think the desert makes people crazy. And there is serious poverty in Salt Lake that’s conveniently swept under the rug. This place is fucking barbaric to outlanders. As far as I’m concerned, they can keep it. I’m off to beautiful, rainy, green Oregon.

  17. Like any state, not everybody who lives in Utah is exactly a nice person, and not all mormons are bad. Please don’t judge the entire church based on a few people who don’t practice what is really taught. I am a mormon, but I don’t have anything against anybody who isn’t. My best friend is not a member, and I don’t even try to convert her cause I know it doesn’t interest her. Part of my family doesn’t belong to the church, but they are still great people. The majority of my ex’s aren’t members – but they are still wonderful people. To judge somebody based on where they live or by their religion based on a few ignorant people makes you just as judgemental as them. To the author of this website, I hope someday you can see that there really are some good people in Utah and that not all Mormon’s are bad. Please don’t respond to this with a mean comment, because I won’t yell back at you. Best wishes to everybody!

  18. UTAH SUCK! We’re getting out as soon as possible! I’d tell you where we’re headed, but the people there are nice and friendly and I’m afraid some of the assholes from here would just follow us and ruin it. A warning if you’re thinking of moving here: WATCH YOUR BACK! There are more crooked and corrupt people and business here than the rest of the US put together!

  19. Seriously, if it wasn’t for getting my career started, I wouldn’t be in this God-forsaken place. Mormons are the most hypocritical people ever! How crazy is it that some even put down their position or name of their ward in their resumes! Obviously, they think that this will get them the job! Idiots! And why do they have to send their “missionaries” to other countries? Why? Do they think that they’re uncivilized and needs “salvation”!? I know for damn sure that if the same asian/latino/african person knocks on the door of a Mormon family, they wouldn’t even open it! How hypocritical! What a cult! I’m going back to Cali ASAP. Utah can kiss my sweet ass good bye!

  20. We moved here from California when we became mormons because we wanted to be with our fellow people.
    Oh God that was a mistake.
    As soon as we got here, we left the mormon religion because I have never seen so much discrimination and racism in my life! Not even in Los Angeles with the racists cops do you get discriminated and stared at moronically just by walking into a gas station to buy a soda here in Utah.

  21. When I got here in 1995 it was a saturday night. I turned on the telivision in my motel room and thought that Saturday Night Live, had been cancelled! Come to find out, Mormon owned KSL (NBC affiliate), saw it was in the best interest of everyone not to broadcast it anymore. Did SNL humor piss off these people? Was it directed at thier faith? Or was it, that, they made fun of Donny and Marie and “You just don’t do that!” You know what I say, “Fuck ‘em if they can’t take a joke!” I believe in God. God bless the WB for airing SNL!

  22. the problem with mormons is the officials are afraid that theyre new recruites and old might be told the truth about the cultist world and man made religon they live. they are afraid of bible believing christians.who know the real truth

  23. yes utah is a fucked up planet! these ass backward Nigham young followers are just a step above Jim Jones TOO BAD THEY WON”T DRINK THE KOOL AID!!(wishful thinking) as far as i am concerened the US has only 49 states. utah is out of the picture LOL! no wonder these inbred freaks got kicked outta Missouri !these are the most brainwashed can’t do anything without approval of the cult/church inconsiderate fucks i have ever seen i can only imagine what the other countries think of us after having the olympics there. them GOD i hope the rest of us NORMAL PEOPLE in the other 49 state don’t get “stereotyped” with those low class freaks too bad P.T Barnam is not alive he could turn utah into a circus freak show and make billions LOL
    have a great week..

  24. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but it hurts so much how much people hate Mormons. I am a Mormon, and I absolutely love my religion, and my wholefmaily lives in Utah. Heaven forbid that they don’t sale beer on Sunday in Utah. Frick. Anyways, did you know I am related to you? I am a Udink also. You are my dad’s second cousin I think.

    1. Thats your problem. “Heaven forbid they dont sell beer on Sundays frick” that sums up why people hate Mormons and Utah right there. Some of us WANT to buy beer or alcohol on Sundays. We want to have a barbeque and have a few cold beers with friends over and a ball game on on Sundays. We may even want to *gasp* play hard rock or rap music with *gasp* inappropriate language in some of the music. You all cant comprehend these things because you think they are “evil” we look at it as having a good time and celebrating freedom!

      This is why non Mormons cant stand Mormons. Because you dont understand the rest of the world. You live in your little bubbles with “heavenly father” and that con man Joseph Smith. The church should NOT be able to tell a Government what can or can’t be sold on Sundays! The funny thing is I dont even drink. Im not a Mormon but my lifestyle is very Mormonish I guess you could say. I dont drink, party, etc. I am a family man. However the difference is that I WANT people to be able to enjoy those things if they enjoy them. The Mormons try to control things to be the way they want them to be.

      Fuck Utah. Fuck Mormons.

  25. ok i just moved to Utah from Ohio and let me just say I HATE IT HERE. it is the worst state ever. every single corner has a freaking mormon church. god forbid they have any other types of religions…it really sucks living in Utah and NOT being a mormon cult freak. the mormon culture has ruined this whole state. fuck utah

  26. I moved here from California 4 years ago. I really tried to integrate into my new town, Orem, UT. I still isn’t happening. I would give anything to go back to California – I lived there for nearly 30 years – but I am disabled and stuck living at home with my Mom.
    I have never had people treat me so cruelly, and aloofly in my entire existence!! The only friends I have here are a few family members. No one in Orem dares to be my friend because they might turn gay.
    I, too, HATE UTAH WITH A PASSION!!!!!!!!!!

  27. I forgot to mention in my previous posting that I, too, am a Mormon. Let me tell you, the Mormons in California are cool for the most part. The Mormons in Utah seem to have all gone to sleep during church and never learned much about not casting judgment, not shunning people that are different than you; I guess all those lessons about celebrating diversity went down the “crapper” when they came home from church.
    The Mormons I knew as a kid in Cal. were way different than these “yahoos” in Utah. I have never felt so bad about myself as I have since I came to Utah. This state is full of back-stabbers, two-faced assholes, retards, bad drivers, RUDE-ASS PEOPLE and utter and complete disappointment.
    My SISTERS ALL HATE IT TOO. Utah is only a state for those who follow the status quo.
    And another thing, why do people constantly STARE around here. At first, I thought it was me and then I started talking to some other people about it and they all said they are stared at too. What the HELL IS WRONG WITH THESE FREAKIN’ WEIRDOS? Utahns are rude ignoramises (sp?)
    Want to hear how my Dad got out of here – -HE FREAKIN’ DIED!!!!!!
    My family and I call people from Utah = Utards because they are odd people and they do odd things. We call Orem = Borem because its so damn boring.
    I do like the beautiful mountains and some of the scenery, but its the people that do all the DAMAGE to the state.
    Utah needs new blood, more diversity, less clannish behavior and less in-breeding in certain families = some of ya’ll have a certain look about you (the in-breds, that is). You need to marry into some other blood lines.
    Sorry to bash Utah, but you guys have bashed me and my feelings in some many different ways. Its payback and time to tell the awful truth.
    Your state is not ZION because Zion literally means “those that are pure in heart”. How can you be pure in heart when you’re so rude, mean and bigotted? Zion is also defined as the North and South American Continents, Utah alone ain’t Zion!!!!!! So get over the holier than thou garbage.
    Utah Hater signing out!

  28. I moved to Utah from Cali. when I was but 15 years old and i lived there for about 8 years. It was hell!
    First of all, the high schools suck. What was surprising to me was the fact that different kinds of kids intermingled with each other. White, Hispanic, Black, punk kids, whatever would normally know each other, and on occasion hang out together. Those were usually the non-mormons as there was usually a fine line drawn between the non-mormons and the mormons that each side would generally not cross.
    The whole state is filled with a bunch of haters. My god, I have never seen so many people hate on California (particularly L.A). Everything that goes wrong in Utah is somehow blamed and linked to L.A. What is even more annoying is how the state tries to compare itself to California. This state will never be California! Or normal much less.
    Lagoon. Are you kidding me? The theme park sucks ass. I think Ive only gone there twice since i was 18. The rides are shitty and built for 12 year olds (come on, the bat?) pathetic.
    Social acceptable standards. If you are not mormon, you dont belong. Try being a single male, non-mormon.
    When you look at all the problems with the state it has to be traced back to the LDS church and the hypocrocies that lie
    The alcohol restrictions. Caused by the LDS church and its members who dont want to see a liquor section in the grocery store because their “wussy” ass children will be able to see it. And they dont want people to get too drunk, therfore they restrict the possession of kegs, lower the alcohol volume to 3.25 and only sell liquor in state liqor stores.
    The little churchies across the street from schools and universities. Lets face it, if you are not part of the population that crossess that street, you are an outsider! From high school, all the way to College, you are not part of “UTAH SOCIETY” if you do not cross the street.
    Heck you cant even drink alcohol on College campuses. what the hell is up with that? Grown people being babysat! when i finally transfered to a real school here in california i was so surprised at the acceptance of drinking alcohol, to the point where i have been able to attend cocktail parties on the school, which serves a great and idealistic purpose of networking.
    What the hell is BYUs deal? constrictive learning is all that it is. god forbid you should have facial hair before an exam!
    Im glad to say that i no longer live in utah, nor will i ever live there again! the whole state can rot,

  29. I live in Utah and have never lived anywhere else to compare it to. I grew up mormon but was not very in to it and I used to drink with the best of them. There were plenty of bars, clubs, and parties to go to. I became Mormon again BY CHOICE when I was about 22. I have not regretted that choice. All the Mormon church wants us to do is stay away from things that are addicting, like drugs and alcohol, because addiction takes AWAY our freedom. FYI we do not judge you if you are not Mormon. I am so sick of people saying that. WE DO NOT CARE what you do. We are very aware that it is NORMAL to drink alcohol if you are not Mormon and we are aware of what is going on in the world. I hardly have any friends that are Mormon and at every job I ever had I hardly worked with any. No, I am not judging you. I am living this way by choice and because it has made my life better. I believe I am an alcoholic and if I was not Mormon, I would probably still be drinking too much and would probably be dead due to other out of control behavior I was involved in. IT IS THE OTHER WAY AROUND!! Mormons are being judged and no, we are not judging you. We would never say these cruel things about people, yet you are saying it about us.

  30. p.s…Everyone does not pay for bankruptcy by the way. Only if you are paying high interest on a credit card. If you are doing that, you probably do not care about money that much anyway. In a chapter 13 bankruptcy, the debtor pays back some, if not all of their creditors and in a chapter 7 bankruptcy, the creditors eat it. They deserve it anyway. Most Mormons are likely filing chapter 13 bankruptcy because that is what you file when you have assets you want to keep which would be houses and cars which by the way….if you are keeping, you have to pay for even in bankruptcy. I say most Mormons file a chapter 13 because Mormons buy houses early on since they have larger families than the norm. If you owe taxes, child support, or student loans, you still have to pay all of that back no matter what (except in some cases for the taxes) so I do not see how everyone is paying for other people’s bankruptcies.

  31. How can you say Mormons don’t judge others for not being mormon? You have the ONLY chosen religion do you not? We are just heathens who will burn in hell for not worshiping your perverted prophet and following your mindless life! Good luck with your garments and annointings! (for those who don’t know what I mean, google it*&%@#)

  32. YaY! A Place I can vent!
    Well what do you know? There ARE “normal” people that live here in this god forsaken state called Utah!
    We moved here from the Seattle area a few years ago, and as much as I have tried, I just can’t take living here! But we have to because of my husbands job. Unless a miracle happens, we have twelve more lonnnnnng years until he retires, then WE ARE OUT OF HERE! I have actually given thought to taking depression medicine, and I don’t even like taking aspirin if I can help it! But then I have to tell myself, don’t give in and give up!
    Don’t become like so many Utahn’s here who are already living on prescription pills because they can’t handle their lives for whatever reasons. Which I could think of plenty. If you are Mormon, could it be because of all of the stress you put yourself through having to live up to all the church expects of you in your lives? Maybe it’s all of the kids you keep pumping out, and can’t control or control too much?
    I suppose I would walk around like looking like a zombie too, if I had to walk in your shoes, and PrEtEnD that I am perfect or should be perfect every minute of every day.
    I never knew what a jack mormon was until I moved here. I figure the percentage within this state must be high, with as many as I have personally met so far in the last few years.
    They will say….
    “Well…. yes…. I am Mormon. BUT, I am not a practicing Mormon. I drink alcohol (such as it is here), I drink espresso’s (if you are lucky enough to find a Starbucks or any espresso bar within 30 miles) and so on and so on. But I do go to church once and a while”.
    Poor souls. They probably are so afraid NOT to go to church, because they are shunned and treated terribly by the church and their followers when they do!
    It did not take long to notice how different it is here. It was really like a culture shock for me. If someone had asked me what town I lived in, which is Brigham, I would say alway’s “Stepford”, (Like the movie Stepford Wives).
    When I go to the grocery store or any store for that matter, people (the females) always stare! I feel like I am in a bad movie where I am living in “The Land Of The Living Dead, and somehow they know you are not one of them. It’s scarey.
    I am an average 46 year old white female with a family, and not someone that looks like they should be touring with the Barnum Bailey Circus.
    But somehow THEY KNOW! She is not Mormon or… she is not from here!I have no idea what is going through there heads.
    Probably nothing, since I have noticed to, how, well for lack of a nicer word, “dumb” many people are here.
    Aside from the ignorance, could one of the reasons be the alcoholism that runs rampid here? Hmmmm…geeee…I wonder why so many Mormons and non-mormons turn to alcohol here in this state? Could it be because it is sooooooooo depressing here? After all it’s the frickin’ desert. It’s all brown and flat AND it is sooooooooooooooo boring here. Unless you like to hike, ski, or are mormon (and surprise! not everyone here does or is!) there is not much else to do besides drink! I have met more alcoholics in this state in the past 2 years, than in my whole life, and I DON”T drink, but every once in a great while.
    When we first moved into our house, there was not a week that went by for a couple of months, where there wasn’t always someone, or a group of people, at the door trying to convert us to Mormonism. Asking all kinds of personal questions too. After a while, I quit answering the door. Then one day they came to our door, I didn’t answer, (which is my right, since after all…. it is
    MY HOUSE!) They knew I was home and they left one of their cards behind. On it they wrote, “We are not as scarey as we look, next time open the door”.
    I was sooooo pissed off, thinking… Who do you think you are coming to my house, basically threatening me?! Of course, I was really hoping they would come back, one more time, so I could give them a piece of my mind. But of course, they never did, and that was that.
    I don’t know about the men, but the woman are very guarded and highly defensive. That would be the nice way of putting it.
    I am used to being around more layed back people, a more diverse culture,
    more choices, friendlier people. I really have not found that here. I have met just a few, nice normal people so far. I know there has to be more out there somewhere!????
    I feel like I am living at the end of the planet, out in the middle of NO MANS LAND.
    No wonder often times resturants (which are few), and fast food places have so many times said to us….we are out of that. How can you be out of hamburgers at a hamburger resturant????? Oh that’s right, we live, what feels like a zillion miles away from the rest of the world, and since we live in NO MANS LAND it takes way longer to get anything trucked in here! I have learned while going to a department store in the Spring to…buy it now (if you are lucky enough to find something you really like, as there’s not alot of choices here!), or you are sh*t out of luck, until m-a-y-b-e…..next year!
    Speaking of trucks! I have never in my life, in all of the places I have lived, seen soooo many frikin’ semi trucks on (by the way) the ONLY major highway Utah has! I won’t even drive on the freeway unless I absolutely have to. Between the semi’s and the crazy drivers who constantly tailgate ABOVE a rediculous posted speed of 75 M.P.H. It’s crazy. I feel like I am trying to survive my half hour trip to town by driving on a frikin’ race track. The worst drivers are the woman, and as always, some teenagers too. But the biggest surprise was to find that many of these woman driving their big gas guzzling suv’s and vans have their own kids, and lots of them. How do you know? Because the mormon women have those decals in their windows that kind of look like stick people. So if they have, let’s say….12 kids, their whole window is consumed with 12 stick figures, representing how many children they have. Great example you are setting for your kids. They need to put signs up, out on the roads “Watch Out For Rude, Pushy, Grouchy Mormon Mothers”.
    Before we came here, every person I had told back home, that we were planning to be moving to Utah, had nothing but negative things to say. They would say…”You don’t want to move there!” “Do you have kids? If your not mormon, your kids will have a tough time in school, because they will often be left out.”
    Everyone had a story to tell, either from their own experience from being here or someone they knew had lived here and then left. Or just from things they had heard. I have even had people I have met here, who have lived their whole lives in Utah, (mormon & non-mormon alike) basically say….”Get out while you still can. I would if I could!”
    I’ll end my story by saying this….
    To be fair,I had decided to come to Utah with an open mind. To determine for “myself” what it was like. To not go by what everyone was telling me back home.
    Well I have found out for myself.
    THE TRUTH BE TOLD…
    “THEY WERE ABSOLUTELY DEAD ON WITH EVERYTHING THEY HAD TO SAY ABOUT UTAH”.
    I hear that Utah is comprised of about 60% mormons and 40% non-mormons, give or take a jack mormon or two :)
    I have also been hearing about all of the people, recently moving here from other states, because their jobs brought them here and most are NOT mormon.
    So unfortunately all I can say from my own experience is this…..
    Although I would not be willing to encourage anyone to move to Utah, unless they LOVED SKIING & HIKING & wouldn’t mind living in a cave.
    I think that if this dried up hell-whole of a place has any hope of catching up to the 21rst century and ALL that it has to offer (before the world comes to an end :)…lol….., it is going to come by way of the diverse people that move here from other states, and balance, if not tip the mormons scales.
    Famous quote….
    “Utah is a nice place to visit.
    But you wouldn’t want to live there, even if your mormon.”
    P.S. Someone who has lived here for several years said to me, “You’ll get used to it.” I responded…..”I don’t want to GET USED TO IT, then I’ll become like THEM”.
    One more thing. I left Washington thinking…
    I will not miss the clouds and the rain and the traffic.
    Oh god how I miss the clouds and the rain and the traffic now!
    Even though the sun shines often in Utah and you do get to experience a real summer here. There is still a big black cloud of gloom & doom that hovers over this place, and I’m not just talking about the Awwwwwwwwwful smog.
    Rah! Rah! Utah!…The Best Dysfunctional State On Earth!

    1. Try being a light skinned black woman walking around with her white husband. That “special” inbred stare becomes a staple. Just being there made me want to rip every single stupid, slack jawed, pasty, ignorant, mormon face off. I was just shocked at how angry that state made me. I’m generally a really chill laid back person that can get along with anyone, but after that third sister wife stares at you a little too long for comfort, you’re about ready to go postal! I’m from the south and I swear to God I have NEVER seen more mullets than in Ogden. I swear I saw an honest to goodness RAT TAIL! my first reaction was “What. The. Fuck?” My second thought was “Shit. I’m from Mississippi and I’m shocked. Truly and utterly SHOCKED.” As boring as states like Kansas is, I would gladly live a thousand lifetimes tucked away on a flat farm there before I’d spend even 5 minutes in Utah again. Apparently I’m one of the lucky ones. I actually got to leave. Not many people get to. Best bet is to never go. Don’t test it, for there is about a 98.6% chance that you will not be able to leave!

  33. Awesome site :) My husband and I got the FUCK out of that SHIT HOLE last June. Fuck that place. I hate every single Mormon piece of shit there. “THEY” have got to be the stupidest people I have ever seen in my life. They live in their little bubble. Utah is the gayest, shittiest place I’ve ever been in my life. They are a cult. Ugh, Mormons…fucking worthless. Some restaurants you go in don’t even serve Tea, coffee, soda, let alone god forbid a fucking 3.2% beer. I’m so glad to be almost 5,000 miles away from that place.
    What is wrong with those stupid fucks? I mean anyone who translates their “bible” out of a fucking hat off magic golden plates? What the fuck drugs were they on? BTW: I’m not a member of any religion, so don’t think I’m trying to just pick on them.

  34. I’m European, but lived in Utah for14 Months. I moved from London and married a Utah mormon. I loved Utah, but the LDS Church is a life control type of cult.
    I do as I please, even in the so called church. in the end I left the LDS because my wife was a total bitch. brain washed I guess by the LDS. I’m now divorced and live back in Europe. I say do what you want in life. however if you stop going to Church they turn on you. and blame you for everything, will not listen to a word you say. don’t understand your feelings. I think Mormons are child like. they like paper cups, and kid’s drinks. they let the LDS control too much in life. I broke almost every rule in the LDS church because I ME. I want to live MY LIFE. you know I have a wonderfull heart full of love. but they only see what they want to. I feel people will talk about this type of thing for years. but only you can free your mind and life. and thats what I did. I really miss Utah, it’s a lovely place. wish LDS Members would do what they really want to do, and be free.Oh yes they are stupid too. they think they know everything. and they are never wrong. I will sum it all up now; YOU CAN DO WHAT YOU WANT IN UTAH, AS LONG AS YOU ATTEND CHURCH ON SUNDAY.

  35. FUCK UTAH, fuck your stupid laws, fuck your politics, fuck your outdated archaic religion (CULT), fuck your garments, fuck your boring fucking state, fuck you when you keep telling me I need a membership in order to have a beer, fuck your incest ways you use to increase the size of you mindless followers, fuck all the jack-Mormons, fuck all you missioniers that keep coming to my door univited, fuck all the 7-11′s I mean churches on every fucking corner, fuck the whole state. YOU CAN KEEP IT!
    The only thing I’ll miss when I leave is Wendover, and the shitty fishing that those fucked up Mormon’s fucked up.
    Good bye and good riddence.

  36. OK all I see here is a bunch of people who have no real cule of what is bad, so you can’t get Beer on Sunday who cares is it that inportant to have that Beer why not just pick up extra on Saturday, the name calling shows that you are the narrow mined ones and if you whould just sit back and think about it you whould see that if life was so bad there for you, that YOU would MOVE get out if it’s that bad I’m in the military and live back east and I do have family there and i like the state alot and the people may get you mad. but now look at it from my view I go out and fight for you to and all the others in utah to have your freedom and all you can think about is BEER on Sunday and Big Rig Trucks and how the Members of the Church out there are closed mined. I wish that all of you who seem to not get along there could see the Blood Shed and the terror that we as military mebers see every day. no place is perfect and I can tell you there are the same probleems everywhere in the great Nation. So Grow Up and take it one day at a time and once aging if its that bad MOVE
    GOD BLESS AMERICA and the TROOPS

    1. You chose to join the military. Shut the fuck up. You arent protecting our freedoms. What do you think Iraq and Afghanistan have anything to do with our national security? lmfao. I hate when military people act like we owe them something. You CHOSE to enlist. You knew what you were getting in to. You probably enlisted because you arent intelligent enough to go to college. Those are just facts. I dont owe you anything and neither does anyone else. If I want to honor those who serve ill honor the troops from World War 2 who actually DID fight for our freedoms. Not to protect oil rigs. lol.

      1. @sean….you and I need to get together, if you still live here! You sound like a fellow truth seeker as well. Completely agree with your stance on the military!

  37. I am from Seattle. I am one of the people who found this site about a month ago, and was relieved to find a place to be able to express my point of view and my personal experiences, about living here in Utah, along with others who in their own ways find it a very confined, judgemental, a bubble like state to live in.
    The People of Utah (not all of them of course, but the majority unfortunatley),
    who are afraid of NOT having control in their lives,
    believe they can fix it.
    By, well……
    being,
    overly-controlling!
    Yes, that always works. Doesn’t it?
    This sort of decision is certainly not a new concept to this planet, but none the less, still an important issue to many.
    In this case…. when it comes to LIVING in the State of Utah.
    If you put some time in and do some real, honest, open-minded, investigating, you will find this to be true.
    The rumor being….
    That Utah is an ok state to visit, but you wouldn’t want to live there.
    Hmmmmm….why you ask?
    Do your research!
    I am guessing that this rumor secretly thrills the many of Mormon natives of Utah, as they would rather not have any strangers living amoung them, especially if you are not of the faith, and into the way THEY do things around here. Or if they can’t convert you.
    Let me make myself perfectly clear!
    Not ALL Mormons are this way.
    But….the majority are.
    And…the majority does rule here in Utah.
    Anyway, my main point in writting alllllll of this, is that I would like to respond to the person who left the last comment above, regarding the war.
    After some careful thought, this is what I would like to share…..
    In response to this comment that the he had left…
    “So Grow Up and take it one day at a time and once again if its that bad MOVE”
    I say……
    Wouldn’t it be nice, if it was just that simple????
    That a war like we have going on right now in Iraq, would create everyone on the entire planet to stop and pause, and then….
    To say to themselves….
    “Well, there are alot of people worse off than I am, people fighting in the war for instance, people dying, people being killed.
    So, what right do I have to complain??????”
    Then POOF! Like a magical wand or a rain of fairy dust that covers the planet!
    All of our worries, anger, hostility, complaints….whatever!
    Would just magically disappear!
    How wonderful would that be!?
    Then just imagine…as a result, how everyone would be able to just get along with eachother!
    No more road rage, no more wah…wah…wahhhh!
    Gee…..
    “Just imagine that”
    It sounds like an almost perfect world!
    But unfortunatley….”In the REAL world we are living in”
    the TRUTH is…
    Everyone, everywhere, has there own individual struggles they deal with everyday. Sometimes we blame ourselves ,many times we blame others.
    That’s how it is.
    Yes, I know that is hard to imagine. It’s Shocking! But it’s true.
    Troubles come in all shapes, sizes and quantities.
    Just like it does for the men and women who are fighting the war in Iraq.
    We all, may not be experiencing, what you are, in your fight over there.
    But at the end of the day, unless you are medicated 24/7…we still ALL have feelings that we deal with and that are important to us as individuals.
    We all still struggle!
    Regardless of how petty our struggles may seem to you, they are still valid to that person, and makes each individual no less valuable, or un-important.
    On the one hand, you talk about how we should appreciate more, how you are fighting for your country.
    Yet on the other hand, you seperate yourselves from the general public, by basically telling them, I am fighting for your freedom, grow up! As if your feelings are more valid than the rest of the countries.
    Because why?
    You matter more? You are more important? You are an authority on who should feel what? and when? and how much? or maybe just, not feel anything at all?
    I don’t get that.
    What exactly were you trying to say??????????????????????????????????
    Regardless of where we are all living, or what we are all doing.
    The world keeps turning, even with a war going on.
    Unfortuantley, there are people who are not waking up to the reality that wars never solve anything.
    So we are doomed to repeat the past.
    But it’s human nature isn’t it?
    No one can tell us what to do, even when it sounds right.
    We have to do it our own way, because we always know whats best for ourself. Then we hopefully learn from our mistakes, even if it means making those mistakes over and over again.
    We human beings can be stubborn!
    So, I say to the soldier. Yes, you are fighting a war, and no-one ever stated anywhere on this page that they don’t appreciate what you do.
    Did they???
    Where?
    I don’t see it.
    But, if like you said, our “Freedom” is what you are fighting for, then it must include… The freedom to feel.
    The freedom to express how you feel.
    However one chooses to express, as long as you are not physically hurting someone else while you are doing it. (For example, a husband exressing his anger, by beating his wife or kids).
    Or by PUSHING it on someone else.
    No one here was doing any of that to you were they?
    You don’t have to agree with what or how anyone on this page, has expressed their feelings concerning living in Utah.
    I would hope that you might have some concern for Utah as well though.
    I am serious.
    If your family is here and you like Utah, then all the more reason for you to have concerns for this state.
    But it does mean opening your eye’s to the bigger picture.
    But!……That can be a scarey thing to do.
    Hmmmmmm……..
    Um…..Better stay in your safety bubble where they keep playing repeats of Leave It To Beaver and Andy Griffith. Don’t forget to make time to watch The StepFord Wives too.)
    It’s much safer that way.
    Now, if you are asking for the respect of others, for what you are having to feel and live with in your own daily life,…. ie: fighting in the war in Iraq.
    Then don’t you think you should also be giving that same respect to everyone else. Including those who are NOT fighting in the war?
    It only seems fair. Don’t you think?
    With all due respect, because you are a soldier fighting in the war, does not make you any better, (nor any less of course), of a person, than the rest of the population, who…….. are NOT fighting in Iraq.
    No, you did not say you were better, but it was implied.
    Like, your life in Iraq is more important and we should be grateful!
    That we are a bunch of un-grateful’s!
    I believe everyones problems are relative.
    If it is important to that individual, then it IS important!
    Regardless of how YOU might think of it, as being trivial.
    The bottom line is, wars are “all-ways” about control when you get down to it.
    It’s based on an fear and emotion or emotions.
    Remember…… that while you have stated that you are there to fight for everyone’s freedom, then it has to mean, that you are fighting for everything you see, hear, read, smell, touch, taste in America and beyond as we see it right now.
    And that the reality of it all is……. that it’s not all a thornless bed of roses you are fighting for.
    Every one of those roses has a thorn or two…..or three….or four!
    I have heard people here say…I couldn’t live in Seattle. It rains all the time!
    Well, it does rain alot. Not ALL the time, but more than in the desert!
    I even had someone tell me here, there are too many trees in Washington State, (but it’s beautiful there :)
    Lol….I have never heard that one before! Too many trees… I had to laugh.
    I didn’t take any of that personal.
    While Utah, is growing, it is not widely believed as “THE PLACE” to live.
    Why?
    I’ll tell why. In a nut shell……
    The Mormon population and how controlling, and judgemental they are of their own and of others, and how they treat others. Like they are better.
    I didn’t create that description. THeY created that reality here in Utah.
    It’s just unfortunate. The world should be working on coming together, not seperating themselves, with the mentality of “I am better than thou”.
    There are many Mormons who live in other states, who won’t move here to Utah, because of the way the Utah Mormons live and treat others. With an elitist attitude, and in a big bubble to protect themselves from the outside world.
    WoW!
    I’d say that gives one something to think about.
    I have friends and family in Washington State too.
    And no…life is not perfect there.
    There is more rain than sunshine.
    There is way more traffic.
    There are alot more people that live there, than here in Utah.
    But! I have to say…if you really want to talk about freedom. Washington State wins hand down compared to Utah.
    Utah restrics your freedom in many, many ways, Utah doles it out when and where they see fit, as only to not step over the line so as we get too far from The Town Of Stepford.
    Try, try, try as you may. You can’t hide from reality forever! Although you never hear much about Utah on the World News and such. Gee I wonder why???
    I have an surprise for you. You are still on the Map. Oh yes, there is no magic cloaking device, to keep you hidden from the rest of the world. Safe, and unknown in your protective bubble!
    Believe me…. people, and I mean ALOT of people know about you, and the majority is….. lets just say….
    not too pleased with the thought of moving to Utah.
    That is putting it lightly.
    I believe for those who say on this page, that their un-happiness about Utah, is over the beer (or lack there of).
    It’s really about not liking to be controlled, or the opposite, feeling out of control.
    Ahhhh yes. One of the many things Utah Does control here is the liquor.
    Now I am not a drinker.
    But if you want to talk about how YOU are fighting for OUR freedom, in Iraq. Then you have to include the right to drink if you want to, and when you want to. (As long as you are not putting any one elses life at risk).
    Right?
    Mormons don’t HAVE to drink if they choose not to, but do they really have the right to make that choice for everyone else that chooses to live here or has to live here for what ever reasons???????
    No!
    But there we are again.
    It’s about control.
    There is an abundance of seperation that goes on in the world.
    Mormons who seperate themselves from non-Mormons. Blacks from whites etc.
    The so called beautiful (blonde, skinny and famous) from the average “nobody”. The list goes on and on. You see it everywhere, it’s all around.
    Now, I take offense to your insinuating that because you are fighting in Iraq, no one should complain about anything, because of what you and the others are doing in this war (for the rest of us).
    That is a bit egotistical, don’t you think?
    That somehow, what you are experiencing, should make everyone elses life seem so much better, as if it is our duty to be happy 24/7 because your life or lives are much harder than the rest of ours is.
    Who are you to say? You don’t know about my life. You don’t know what I have lived.
    And besides! I didn’t ask for this war to begin with.
    Nor did thousands of other people.
    Really! No one likes war! (Unless your Hitler).
    But never the less… here we are.
    And we are all in it together.
    You don’t know me, you don’t know about my life, beyond the paragraphs I have written here on this site. You don’t have any idea about how I truely feel about the war. You have not sat down with me to find out who I am.
    Regardless of what my beliefs are concerning any war. That does not automatically define me as someone who dis-respects the soldiers who are there.
    But you know, If the problem is that you don’t feel appreciated for what you are doing in Iraq, maybe you should find another website, where people are specifically addressing their feelings concerning this war we are in, and type in your thoughts and frustrations there.
    For me, it was important to be able to vent my thoughts here, like I did a month ago.
    Which helped me to fascilitate some feelings of freedom for myself, living here in Utah.
    I don’t push my beliefs onto ANYONE!
    But! I have experienced a few times where Mormons have literally tried to push their beliefs on me.
    And by the way, about the your advice to everyone…
    Quote….
    ” So Grow Up and take it one day at a time and once agian if its that bad MOVE”
    I can guarantee you, it will not help anybody.
    If that was truley your intention.
    Which by the sounds of your comments…..was not.
    So I end with this thought…..
    If the problems in peoples daily lives, here in Utah (or elsewhere in the world), were so easy to “Fix”, as you have stated.
    Then why are we, IN A WAR?
    P.S. We ALL need to grow up.
    That includes you too.
    So now……
    With all of that being said.
    ~In all that I deal with in my own life.
    I have never forgotten
    about the soldiers in Iraq AND their families.~

  38. Why should we seperate religion and state? People came to America for religion- thats why it was founded if you are too stupid to know your history. People need to get over it or go to another country. Yeah how about you try that and then see how stupid this country is, or in particular, Utah. Get over it. Do you live in Utah??

  39. Oh yeah and by the way. the BYU article you put on makes no sense on why you say that Utah is messed up. For one its a church school and they set standards that the people who attend the school must follow and if they dont, yes it can end in suspension. If you dont want to follow the rules of the school dont attend the school- that has nothing to do with Utah being stupid. If you dont want to attend BYU and follow the standards- go to UVSC which is next door.

  40. To the person who wrote why should we separate state and religion?
    This just shows how ignorant you are. In fact the US is a secular state as their Constitution reads.
    “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances”
    This totally invalidates your argument. If the US had been found on religion. This amendment will have not purpose.
    One thing I can agreed with you is that the US(some roots in Britain) has been the ground for the birth of many new derivations of Christianity. It seems to me that people who came to the New World did not like something about the traditional religions back home and invented their own and that how everything got started.
    Taking a closer look I can give you some examples;
    Google all these paragraphs. It will give you plenty on how each was born in many cases by one person.
    Pentecostalism;
    Although the 1896 Shearer Schoolhouse Revival in Cherokee County, North Carolina may rightfully be regarded as the literal beginning of the modern Pentecostal movement.
    Methodism;
    Is a group of historically related denominations of Protestant Christianity. The Methodist movement traces its origin to the evangelistic teaching of John Wesley. It originated in 18th century Britain.
    The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints ;( There are two; Fundamentalist who branched out when polygamy was outlawed and the most popular where polygamy is no in their doctrine) See how easy is to split up.
    The LDS church is the largest denomination that claims to be a continuation of the Church of Christ, founded by Joseph Smith, Jr. on April 6, 1830 in New York.[5] Joseph Smith legally established this early church soon after publishing the Book of Mormon.
    Jehovah’s Witnesses;
    Modern Jehovah’s Witnesses originated with the religious movement known as Bible Students, which was founded in the late 1870s by Charles Taze Russell. A schism erupted in 1917 at the beginning of the presidency of Russell’s successor, Joseph Franklin Rutherford. Those who remained supportive of the Watchtower Society adopted the name Jehovah’s Witnesses in 1931 under Rutherford’s leadership.
    The above are just very few of the many man made religions that have been born mostly in the US with some roots in Britain.
    Now unlike traditional religions what do they all have in common?
    • All born in the US(few with roots in Britain)
    • All claim to be the true yet they al contradict their teachings and doctrines.
    • All go around the world trying to expand.
    • They all operate by brainwashing people�s minds.
    • They all run like Enterprises( I guess modeling the US economic model)
    • They all use aggressive marketing campaigns to recruit people ( From my research everything points out that the LDS church has the most aggressive marketing campaign to recruit people.)
    Now I one of those that do not believe in organized religion (man made). However if I would have to choose one It will be;
    Buddhism
    Judaism
    Islam
    And now you might say what these two have in common.
    Is very simple. They operate in real faith. They do not have people going around the world knocking from door to door brainwashing people and increasing their quotas.
    Don’t get confused by miss interpreting that the US is secular state and because of that it has allow for the invention of all these man-made derivations of the Christian Religion. (So you are the ignorant by not understanding the concept of law that has allow you to practice your man made 18th century religion)
    Please educate yourself there is plenty of information of the internet where the origins of all these Christian derivations these have taken place. In addition interpretation of what a secular state means.

  41. We moved here from Ohio a little over 2 years ago with high hopes and open minds. I envisioned my daughter making tons of friends and playing from dawn to dusk with them. We have as many friends in our neighborhood now as we did then (0). We are Methodist, We have a 5 year old girl who has wonders why nobody plays with her, hard to explain to her that we are the wrong religion. We had her in a pre-school for over a year, she had a few mormon friends there I thought. I even helped one of the mothers load here target dept store purchases into her van. Then one day at the mall we see her friend and that mother. We say hello to them, my daughter says the childs name and I fully expect a small conversation to take place. No return hello, no recognition that I or my daughter even exist. What a bunch of phonies. It is even like this walking around our development, if you are not a member of the church, you and your family will be ostracized.
    A question we have is how the heck a married couple around 30 years old can afford a 350,000 house, a new 1 ton diesel pick-up, new suburban for the wife, camper, 4 atv’s, 4 kids, give the 10% tidings the church requires to stay in good standing and mom stays home ???? We make darn good money, only 3 of us and there is no way we can afford all the stuff these people have. They either have some kind of pyramid scheme going on, maybe the state gov. supports them or the church I don’t know. Something smells.
    Speaking of smelling, we looked at over75 houses before we found one that I felt we would not have to gut to make livable. Pigs!! Trailers in the yards, in front of houses, where is the code enforcement?? Oh right it works like everything else only your non-members get the citations. They know who each and every non member is, each ward bishop goes door to door and gives you the we would like to know our friends among us speech, what is your name and number in case we need to get hold of you. All neighborhood functions are posted at the church, if you don’t go there you will never know of any neighborhood activities. They fence in the whole backyard then play with the kids out front so everyone can see them. Multi family homes are very common to with the (mother in law suite), gee I wonder how mother in laws live in them?
    There is NO seperation of church and state, they even have nice little brick buildings off of the schools grounds for those students who want to take “optional lds”classes. PRIVATE schooling is a must for non lds children. Even the public library stuffs reserved books full of lds propaganda.
    Driving around here is like playing russian roulet. They are armed (cell phone) and very dangerous ( MormonAssaultVehicle,BigAssTruck or an H2 Hummer). Like others have said above stay off of anything that remotely looks like a highway.
    Someone said they own coke a cola stock, I do beleive it is pepsi,hypocritical none the less. Think of mormons as politicians and you will understand them fully. We made a min 2 yr commitment, hopefully we will be moving out by 2009.
    I

  42. Utah has more meth labs baseball fields.
    Utah has it’s own man made religion.
    The grerat salt lake stinks (smell like ass).
    Membership only bars make a visitors first 3.2 beer cost $15.
    You can buy 15 drinks at once but can only carry two to your table.
    The air is visable 365 days.
    The SLC county jail is the largest source of income in the state.
    Mining coal or copper in Utah is more important than human life itself.
    Utah is the leading bank robbery state in the USA.
    The light rail system only travels 10 miles, has 61 road crossings and carrys an average of 31 people per hour(see a problem here)
    Has more traffic related deaths per capita and uses federal highway funding for dui enforcement. Riding on mama’s coat tail are ya now!
    SLC police can kill innocent bystandards in a high speed chase (which was called off 5 min. earlier) and not even be brought before a review board.
    More people are killed in crosswalks than in most cities 10 times the size. (step quickly or pay the ultimate price here. But we still luv ya)!!
    Don’t go shopping at Trolley Square without an uzzi.
    People walk the streets at all hours of the night.
    The homeless rate is six times the national average.
    Bans smoking in bars (until the local bars go out of business due to no customes)
    then reinstates the privelage so they get the tax revenue flowing again.
    DUI’s can be dismissed ( Plea in abayence) once the get as much money as you can possably get from you and your family.
    Courts order ignition interlocks even for people who have a suspended drivers license. ( ie. We are in bed with Drager Interlock). Only causing hardship to the family. Nice!!!
    Probation is handled by private treatment centers rather than the state.( You think they will give you a bad review to maximise their intrest and then provide the treatment they impose on you ) Conflict of interest here don’t you think. Illeagle in 49 other states.
    Where is the Zoo?
    Can’t get a good steak either.
    May the Real Jesus Christ bless your stupid miners and Get Them The Hell Out Of Utah… One way or the other. (If ya know what I mean)

  43. Oh! I forgot the most important thing in Utah is education. For your information, James A. Madison Elementary School in Ogden will go down in as the only school in the USA to defy history. Poor Mr. Madison will be supprised to find out that Utah is the only state that has the authority to issue him a middle initial. (long after death I might add). After all he was only the 4th president of the United States. You stupid fuckers need to do research before you teach your kids to be as stupid and thoughtless as you have all grown to love and live by. Who is giong to pay to have all the school letterhead, t-shirts, library cards and not to mention the school sign changed when you find the mistake? Not Me thank you very much! USA Today will have a field day with this one. “Party On Garth”!!!

  44. I currently relocated to the Salt Lake valley for work. The place is beautiful. Especially in the winter. I don’t mind the mormons or any other religion for that matter. As long as they don’t try to shove it down my throat. Compared to california and arizona the higher education in this state could use a little monetary help. Recently junior college in california is pretty much free while Utah rapes you in the ass for higher education. I guess that is not one of the values here or everyone has much more money than I. The driving is terrible although it is pretty bad in arizona too. People just don’t have the concept of speed limits and keeping a safe distance. Where are the freakin cops? I have not seen one person getting pulled over and getting a ticket. Not that I like cops or I like getting pulled over for going 4 miles over the limit, but c’mon the minivan doing 80 on a 65 passing you on the right? What is up with that? Thats just dumb.
    I’m not a hater. I like this place and I hope it’s just a few people that I have seen so far screwing it up. I am still contemplating on moving the family here. Not sure it’s worth it.
    Good day.

  45. fuck mormons and their bull shit rules. they are only trying to take over the world with their fucking missions that go al around the fucking world. the beer sucks and you only have to buy more of it therefor supporting the mormon church in slc fuck that mormons arent allowed to drink by their religious code so why does money go to the church? utah is fucked up thats why and so is the US and so is all other religions. we should all realise that we are just humans and all religion was thought up by some human philosopher who saw great things but then other religions like christianits and mormonism came and fucked it up all you religious people are fucking shit up cut it out wake up to reality mother fuckers

  46. I love this web site!!! Thanx for let’n us all vent. I’m sure we all hate Utah in one respect or another.
    True??? I Think Yes.
    Innit bout time Utah listens to the people in the real world tell their stories?
    I love the land and the beauty but, I hate the people here. They are such, “Self centered A-Holes” .
    Facts….
    1. C’mon and get Jeffs convicted. (Get’n tired of that crap on T.V.)
    2. You Cops quit beating up 70 year old women for not mowing the yard.
    3. Don’t shoot people at 7-11 for sitting in the lot to long. Then claim there was a gun that disappeared ???
    4. Don’t let the cops beat up any more patrons of the health gyms for taking a parking spot before they got there.
    5.There are no restrooms on Antalope Island.
    6. The gas prices are at the top three in the US. Although you have several local refineries. Thus helping the air stay nice and “visable” due to your inverted mass air flow most the year!!!
    7. Mall shootings make the news weekly.
    8. About 91% of the county jail population is there for Meth useage.( See a proglem here) !!!
    9. Can’t smoke indoors but the air outside is the worst in the nation. Second hand smoke is caused mostly by non smokers.(You Still Don’t get it do ya)
    10. I saw 11 unattended cars parked at the airport terminal next to the main building and only one police person in the building!!! (Disaster wating to happen)??? But I’m not T.S.A. approved to notice such things so I’ll leave that for the officials.
    11. Nice hole you left in the Earth!! (Bringham Canyon) You can even see it from space. NICE!!!(Google Earth)
    12. Religion, I will leave for the professionals. (Just quit knock’n on my door)
    13. I can’t think of why I wasted my time telling you all what you should know already so I’ll close for now.
    Again, “Thank You” for the nice web site. You should have a never ending flow of” UDINKS” to keep this going cuz, “It’s all true”…”Party on Garth”

  47. This site confirms everything I already felt about Utah so I now know I am not alone. I visited there this past July with my wife and 7-year old daughter. My brother and his family live in Park City and he invited us to come out there. My Dad and his evil wife were there also, visiting from WV where I am from originally. Well, the family visit was atrocious and awful which I’m sure affected my perception of Utah, but that is not the only reason why I have distaste for that state. One of the other posts here described a ‘creepy energy’ and that is absolutely 100 percent true. It comes from the Mormons who I found to be aloof and unfriendly. As many others have pointed out, there is no growth in that state, intellectual or cultural, because the Mormon Church is so repressive and closed-minded. I can’t believe my brother likes living there, but he and his wife love skiing and hiking so that sustains them I guess. I would be suicidal if I had to live in that hellish place. My brother lives in an expensive neighborhood and the man behind him was robbed and beaten in his own home and my sister-in-laws car was broken into in their own driveway–maybe its all those meth heads stealing so they can get their stash. It was like a fucking oven the whole time we were there–everywhere we went, we roasted. It bothered me and I live in North Carolina! As far as the natural beauty, I was not all that impressed. There are hardly any trees even in Northern Utah, and the mountains are dusty, rocky and brown. The one moose we saw looked malnourished. I was waiting in line with my daughter to go down one of those slide ride things at a resort and we were surrounded by Mormon teenagers who glared at us as if we were dog crap. I will never return to that God-awful State. We were so glad when that plane landed in Charlotte, we wanted to kiss the ground!!!.

  48. I moved to Utah due to a job offer. I am also a photography nut which influenced my decision.
    Moving to Utah was the biggest mistake I ever made in my life. Yeah, it’s pretty country( I have no idea what that other guy was talking about with no trees or malnourished moose ) but the Salt Lake/Ogden/Provo metropolitan area is probably the most polluted area I’ve ever seen, and I’ve been all over the world in my business travels. The pollution is worse than some third world countries that I’ve been to.
    What bothers me the most is the stupidity of the people of Utah. It doesn’t matter if they are Mormons or not – they’re just stupid. I know people think people from certain areas are stupid – people from the south think northerners are stupid, people from the north think southerners are stupid, so on and so on. From my travels I’ve found that people from one part of the country are just as smart as people from another part – except Utah. They are uniformly stupid.
    Other than stupidity Utah people have another defining quality in that they are extremely financially ‘challenged’. Mormons have five or six children, even though the can’t afford that many, then buy expensive houses and SUV’s so they can appear to live up to the Mormon standard of prosperity. Non Mormons just have three or four kids out of wedlock, blow their money on big pick up trucks and ATV’s , then show up late for work every day of the week and bitch about how they don’t have enough money.
    Yeah, and as somebody else said Utahns can’t drive. I’ve never experienced more tailgating in my life as I’ve had in Utah. I’m almost afraid every time I get in my car.
    Although Utah is a very beautiful state – except for the extreme pollution in the Ogden/Salt Lake/Provo metropolitan area – I can’t wait to get out.

  49. HERES THE DEAL ON UTAH……………..
    (pls excuse any mispellings this font is teeny)
    Ok, here is the clearest account of Utah you will get from anyone. My family and I moved here from Utah back in the early 90′s. back then, there was not as much congestion, traffic and a lot less people. Utah was easy to get around in and almost a fun place to live. It was nice to walk around the city in the summer as a kid, and most places still had a small-town feel to them. One thing I will say for even then is…I had a hard time making friends who were not gossipy or fairweather. I had a “best friend” throw me out of her family’s house when I was 18 because I had to work on Sundays, apparently the morons do not believe Sunday is a day for work, only worship. (I had no choice, I was already on my own at that point and had to pay them rent and foot for myself) So, when I was 19 I decided to pack up and move to Rhode Island, because I found a job there (I was a finish painter and a company up there was hiring, and I had some friends up there)
    My life there was so different. I sigh long and hard when I think about it. The people, who were not religious, were the most helpful, shirt off their back types that I ever met. When my car broke down, 2 pulled over to give me a hand, when I HAD no car, 3 would offer me a kind ride home from work even though it was the opposite way. No one ever mentioned gas money or ever wanting a thing in return. I had no family up there. Kind people were buying me lunch at work, inviting me over on holidays, and were always very understanding of my struggle and no one up there had a need for materialism or excess showyness. Everyone drove their cars into the ground and only got another car when it was time, and until then if the car ran, no one cared how new it was or how it looked. I made at least a dozen close friends while up there, good always there for me friends, the kind that you can ALWAYS call and it’s never a bother. The men were gentlemen, understood their jobs, had a set of ba**s, stood up for whats right, and were very giving. The air was pure and beautiful because rhode island had strict enviormental laws and made a lot of efforts to clean up bays, oceans and would ticket those who dumped oil in the water from their boats or speedboats. The rent was cheap. Cars were even cheaper (a 2000 Kia sportage 75,000 miles for around $3,500 to give you an idea,my 1996 Honda accord with 90,000 miles cost me a mere $1,300) anyway…now that you’ve read that…..
    I had to move back to Salt Lake Shitty 2 years ago because my mom is disabled and not doing too well, so of course I moved back here to Salt Lake to help her out. After 8 years of Nature preserves, the ocean down the street and good, modest hard working people, I was back HERE.
    First, I was shocked by the endless “5 o clock traffic.” it never ended.
    Whereas before most 16 year olds that I knew drove old chevy cavaliers and modest older imports….here, every teenager that I saw sported a BMW or Lexus or a subaru with at least $10,000 of work dumped into it. Then, I saw the giant brown cloud that hovers around the city and the bottom of the mountains. Then, the endless giant SUV’s and trucks driven by tiny women with cellphones to their ears. No turning signals, no courtesy, violent “cutting you off” if youre not going at least 90mph like everyone else. I was (and still am) shocked. In the middle of winter, girls wearing mini skirts…tiny shirts, always a skin show and dying to get attention. (Sorry but in the 8 years I lived in rhode island, that was a rare sight…and its not even a religious place.)
    I won’t even start on the general “I am perfect and gorgeous” attitude of the girls here who all copy each others bleach blonde streaked hair, half shirts and sports cars. (Mitsubishi Lancers and eclipses are the daddys girl car of choice, and the endless cheesy personalized license plates are just plain sad…”IMSOHOT…PRINCESS…HERTOY….BUYMEIT…WANTME…no people Im not kidding.)
    Oh, and forget going anywhere with your boyfriend without him getting stared at like you don’t exist…the girls will bend over, wiggle and let it all hang out within a few feet of your man right in front of you. (again, I wish I was kidding.) Makes for a less than romantic evening. Again, I never saw this kind of display of sexual lust or disrespect anywhere else. What the hell is going on here??? how about the old saying “get your own?”
    As far as jobs go, its a right to work state. The last 2 jobs I have been at, one “let me go” because anything over 10 seconds counts as a tardy and I was a few minutes late too many times, another place wrote me up because I called out the days following my father’s death in Europe. (real compassionate, no?)
    I won’t even start on the traffic. A trip to the store is a financial and physical risk…90 is the avarage highway speed for all lanes, and if you have any kind of a sportscar, you will get raced by packs of spoiled teenagers who have nothing better to do than endanger everyone else. The drunk driving is out of control too.
    For a state where the religion emphasizes being physically chaste and clean…
    I have never met and seen more pregnant 15 year olds. Most 20 year olds I met at work already have 3 kids. It was this bad when I lived here “before” my move too. I’m sorry but is there nothing else to do for a 15 year old in this state than to play “how fast can I remove my clothes?” when I was 15, I was more interested in books and nature than making a baby . I had no dad at that point to keep me in line, and my mom never talked to me much about sex ed either.
    The “immigration.”
    Before anyone rips into me with how dare you’s…I was born in Europe, immigrated here with my mom and her then husband, we respectfully learned the English language in a matter of weeks by taking classes, and my mom and her husband both got jobs immediatley and did not have any more kids. We first lived in New York, then came to Utah because my mom’s ex found a job here. I went to school and learned english, and when I was 15 I got my first job. We were always too poor to afford a car, let alone health care.
    After moving back here, this is what Ive seen.
    Families from mexico move here, then have 4-5 kids each, and get free health care, rent allowance and drive nicer cars than my 55 year old mother (who used to travel to Manhattan New York on the subway to make $20 a day cleaning for the wealthy, escaped rape and violence each day as she made her way back home) These mexicans cannot speak a word of english and refuse to learn, seeing it as an insult to them. Most of them don’t understand how to drive, and the number of car thefts and burglaries here since is one of the highest in the nation. They drive brand new Ford trucks, mustangs, even Cadillacs while my mom tries to drive what she can, being disabled. The crime rate in drugs, violence and sexual assault has skyrocketed here since these illegals have flooded the state. You can’t leave any belongings in your car, and if you drive a Honda it has to be parked somewhere visible during the day and at night. The funny part is, people will complain more here in local towns about “eyesores” being built in their high end neighborhoods than this immigration problem.
    No, Im not racist. My closest friends are all from different countries. There is a difference between racism and being disgusted by ignorance.
    The people here don’t stand up for themselves or each other or what’s right…the men have no kahoneys, its the nicest way I can put it. They don’t speak out against the crime, child abuse, nothing…here the motto is “out of sight out of mind.” the people here would rather hear about family activities and stupid concerts in their cultural activity centers. The wife rules the house, the husband hands over the credit card as she spends the rest of the day piloting their luxury SUV from shopping plaza to shopping plaza. I’ve met one girl since I’ve been here who is a good decent mother and wife, but she also has to hold down a job and balance taking care of 2 kids.
    The mormons. My boyfriend’s parents are some of the nicest, most of fashioned people I have ever met, who are modest in every way, kind and live very simply. There are a few “good” mormons left here, As far as the others go…materialistic, showy and just plain fake. Ive been back here 2 years and my boyfriend’s 60-some year old parents are the only nice people Ive met. Aside from that the girl friends Ive tried to make talk about nothing but sleeping around (I’ve began to think this is the sleeping around capital of the world…every female Ive met here so far has a story about it) And most people won’t drive to see you if it’s out of their 15 minute driving limit or might affect their gas tank. Who lives in the valley, stays in the valley. I miss my REAL, unconditional unjudgemental friends back home.
    As far as fun things to do? trying to battle your way up the canyon to be around nature might be something you can try and do, as all terrain vehicles try and run you off the narrow road. People mostly enter congestion in the morning, go to work, enter congestion again, go home and stay home. Forget taking a nice drive or going out, you’ll be blinded by traffic and it will take you 3 times as long to make a simple run somewhere than it would anywhere else. Your life here is sitting in traffic, shopping and doing it all over again. I went from going to cape cod, the beaches, historical sites to sitting in traffic and renting movies for fun. Sadly, most people I’ve met here require little else in life to feel complete. It’s like as long as they have a nice car and a hot wife not much else is important in life. Unfortunately for a woman I’m not big on shopping so there goes the #1 activity in the state.
    The guys…either immature “gnarly dude!” ski bums who have no clue about the outside world, ghettos or hardship…or immasculine men who follow their wives around. Most guys live at home here into their 30′s, something that would be laughed at in Rhode Island, and the girls do the same, bringing their babies home to mom, which is also considered ok. Apparently anything they do thats wrong during the week is made OK as long as they attend church on the weekend. Ive noticed most men here put materialistic “guy toys” ahead of necessity and their kids and the wife or partner is expected to pay her own bills so the man can have his play money. All I can say is Im good…the most respectable, self-sacrificing hard working men Ive ever seen or met are not here. If you want a nice, modest clean place to raise your kids with good values, healthy normal self esteems….DO NOT MOVE HERE. Everyone here thinks they are the most special, unique soul that deserves every ounce of extra attention they can get.
    Im sorry but if you want me to think youre special or amazing…go rescue someone from a fire, serve your country, volunteer, save a life, invent a vaccine, you get the idea. Utahns, stop preaching what you’re not.
    Please feel free to share your own experiences. Maybe I’ll be able to feel like I can relate to someone.

  50. Interesting site. Took a while to read all messages, lots of anti Utah feelings. I moved to Utah from North Dakota in 2005 with a promotion within my company. I came here with an open mind and for the most part still have an open mind. But, I can relate to what a lot of people are saying in the other postings. We live in a rather small community for what seems like a large popluation. There doesn’t seem to be any hurry to modernize. We have very few resteraunts, 3 bars, and other than Walmart, not a lot of choices for shopping. I noticed what seems like lower standards for service than what I grew up accustomed to, and have never been told “we are out of Chicken” @ a KFC untill I lived in Utah. I have not been bothered by LDS at all, but do agree there is more than a noticeable ammount of churches everywhere that at first seemed quite odd. Why would they need so many? Still don’t know. Another thing I noticed was all of the young mothers. I personally have spoken to several women that have had children when they were 15 yrs old. This seems to go on whithout any thought that these are “children having children”. Everyone of these women that I spoke to were older (40 – 50′s), and most were not with thier original partner, or spouse. You can’t get married at 15 yrs old and have a realistic veiw of what you really want or need out of life! I don’t know the exact divorce stats. but my guess is that are quit high. We live close to the Uintah Mts and you can tell there is strong support for hunting but, there is no organized range to target shoot and site rifles. Maybe people don’t need to be all that accurate here. There are going to always be differences between areas and they are going to be noticeable when you are new to that area. You have to actually move somewhere to see those differences and I don’t think many people from this area have lived any where else. When we first moved here we also noticed that a lot of people were either unintelligent or uneducated. We try not to be mean, but more than one laugh has been had over dinner recalling something someone said. I agree with some of the other comments in that, polygamy probably didn’t do any justice to the “brain genepool” that evolved here. We have a good life here, but really don’t think that we will stay and retire due to these noticeable differences. Utah is quite a pretty state, but also odd, and with all experiences in life, remembered for its uniquely odd differences. Since there is really no plans to stay, I don’t hate it here, but other states have so much more to offer.

  51. Well Ihave been here in Utah for almost four years now and I have so many mixed feelings about it. The sites are awesome but most of the people that I have encountered are very narrow minded. And agree that it’s hard to fit in here if your are not mormon. I just don’t understand why a religion could be this way. I think in every religion we are taught to accept everyone no matter their religion or background. And I know that Mr. Hinckley did say this in an interview that I saw. But it’s bullshit because it doesn’t work. Maybe they show what the rest of the country wants to hear but teaches different. I can’t wait to move out of here. We are in the military and just got orders to move. I’ve never been more excited to move from a state than I am about Utah. I hope things change for this state because they do get a bad rap in most places.

  52. WHY DON’T ALL OF YOU WHINING ASSHOLES WHO EITHER GREW UP HERE OR MOVED HERE, PACK YOUR FUCKING BAGS AND LEAVE MY WONDERFUL STATE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE……………..YOU ARE ALL A BUNCH OF BABY-BOOB ASSES!AND THE PEOPLE HERE COULDN’T GIVE A SHIT WHAT YOU THINK

    1. I have been living in utah for five years and I like it here. I grew up in Los Angeles and i became sick of the horrible traffic, slutty superficial women, and racist obnoxios white people. The people here are nice, and the weather is great. I love that everyone hates this state, because that leaves a whole lot of assholes out.

  53. I moved to Ogden, UT, from LA nearly 3 years ago for economic reasons and, yes, if you buy into “cheaper” you will likely get trash or even *shit*. I’ve lived in two other states [didn't grow up in LA] and nobody in Ogden should worry about going to hell because they’re already there. I’m not going to say anything about Mormons because I don’t really believe the stupidity and craziness in Ogden can be blamed entirely on religion. There is a kind of mindless cruelty here that extends to the officials of the city, itself. I have a feeling most of the comments here have been the observations of younger people but I’m a senior citizen, even though I look pretty good for my age–because women in LA are used to trying to look nice, dress fashionably.
    Here’s my incredible story: Before coming to Ogden, I had never even been questioned by the police about anything, much less had a record, nor had ever been kicked out of anything or anywhere. But that’s all changed now. Because I’m retired and there’s nothing else to do, I started attending a senior citizen center for lunch and the possibility of meeting some people. As it happened I met a man there, considerably older than myself, but liked him a lot and began dating him. That’s when all hell broke loose for me. All of a sudden I, the stranger, was branded as a “gold-digger” and a “thief”. Not only did the man’s family [they're not Mormons] hate me on sight but a lot of the old ladies and the staff of that center [also women] began to watch me like a bunch of harpies and accuse me of all sorts of things that had never happened. If you’ve ever seen “Music Man” and the way the women of River City treated Marian the Librarian, then you’ll get the idea–but that was nothing compared to the small town mentality of Ogden, UT. I was accused of “stalking” that man by his family, who even took out a protective order against me, worded like something written by an imbecile–but the judge granted it and nothing could make him change his mind! No wonder the lower court decisions of Utah are overturned more often on appeal than almost anywhere in the nation. What the family was guarding like Fort Knox was their own legacy, even though the man I was dating isn’t wealthy by my standards. Like I said, I’m no kid but to the women here I must have looked like Anna Nicole Smith. Gee, I actually wear eyeliner, cute shoes and *sleeveless* shirts [a Mormon no-no]. Yes, I was younger than that well-preserved man but what a hypocrisy in a state founded by polygamous men whose wives grew progressively younger and younger as they grew older.
    That same crazy family concocted a story about me having stolen some blank checks from that man and filed a police report. Oh, yeah, a person on my level of education just can’t wait to do something so dumb as to forge checks, a Federal offense where you stand a better chance of getting caught than if you actually robbed a bank! Not yet knowing that the ex parte protective order had been petitioned for, I came to the senior center and tried to leave with the gentleman in his car. One of the staff of the center followed us to the street where the car was parked and refused to allow me to close the door on the passenger side. We repeatedly yelled at her to get away from the car, but she wouldn’t, so I kicked her out of the way, locked the door, and we left. Of course, even though this woman had attempted to unlawfully restrain me, she filed an assault report against me and I received a letter from the city of Ogden that the center director had recommended I be permanently banned from the place. A hearing took place on the matter and, even though the man I was dating was a witness for me and claimed on the record I had never done a single thing wrong to him, I was banned, anyway. That’s what happens when an elderly lady tries to get a date in Ogden, UT!
    I have to say, in summary, that I have never been treated as cruelly and narrow-mindedly in my life as in this place, but I’m stuck here now. Yet, if I ever get the chance to leave, I’ll take it in a heart beat. If you’re even thinking of moving here, forget it! Utah sucks for so many reasons and I’m sure the other towns are no better. There is nothing to do in the daytime and certainly not in the evening–except maybe go to a movie. If you were born in one of these god-forsaken Utah towns and can get out–go! You’ll be amazed at the difference in attitudes in larger cities in other states. You’ll actually be able to breathe there without risking the disapprobation of basically stupid, undereducated, over in-bred, persons. Ogden Utah is all about judgment and hate.

  54. I think you are trying to say that Utah sucks for any liberal who lives there, not just someone who isn’t a member of the Mormon church. And also, I think there are the cool Mormons who realize that it is other people’s choice if they want to have pre-marital sex (like myself :P)

  55. What does being liberal has to do with pre-marital sex. Sorry that your concept of being liberal is related to sexual matters. In either case and for the record being liberal is an ideology that goes far beyond sexual matters so please don’t try to put labels to liberals and in case you don’t know what liberals stand for please read below on what being liberal trully means.
    Freedom…
    …of conscience
    You have the right to think as you wish.
    …of religion
    You have the right to worship as you please. The government has no business either supporting or opposing religion in general or any specific religion.
    …of speech
    You have the right to express your views, whatever they may be. Only in the free marketplace of ideas can truth emerge.
    ——————————————————————————–
    Civil rights
    All people are equal under the law. Any type of discrimination based on race, ethnicity, religion, disability, sexual orientation, or gender is not only inconsistent with a free and civil society, but is immoral as well.
    ——————————————————————————–
    Universal public education
    Equality of opportunity requires all Americans to have access to a basic education consistent with maintaining informed citizenship and the ability to participate fully in society.
    ——————————————————————————–
    Tolerance of Differences
    Because we are all unique beings, with different skills, needs, and wants, we must respect the life choices of others as long as their life choices do not infringe on the rights enjoyed by other citizens.
    ——————————————————————————–
    A Social Safety Net
    Recognizing that circumstances beyond mortal control play a part in all our lives, a basic social safety net shall be avaliable to all who need it, not as a permanent lifestyle, but rather as a helping hand to get back on one’s feet.
    ——————————————————————————–
    Employees’ Rights
    We spend most of our lives working. Work is the foundation of our economy and a major part of the glue holding together communities. The employee is an equal business partner with the employer, and as such, has the right to collectively bargain for terms of employment.
    ——————————————————————————–
    Environmental Protection
    Contrary to some people’s opinions, it is possible to both protect the environment and sustain economic growth. We support taking all reasonable and responsible steps to protect the environment and the species contained therein.
    ——————————————————————————–
    Strong Families
    The family is the primary social unit in America. It must be respected, and encouraged in all its forms. Government should make policy with this in mind.
    ——————————————————————————–
    Responsibility
    With rights come responsibilities. Exercising our rights means taking responsibility for our actions, and their effects on others.
    ——————————————————————————–
    Free Enterprise
    The capitalist economic system is the most efficient solution to providing for peoples’ wants and needs. Government’s role is that of a regulator, not a controller of industry, and any regulation must only be for the good of society as a whole, and not for the benefit of any one entity.
    ——————————————————————————–
    Rule of Law
    Law is the framework in which society operates. There can be no society without justice. Justice means that those who commit crimes must be made to answer for them, and that the criminal code is fair and wisely constructed. When criminal actions go unpunished, respect for the law weakens. The law applies to all, including all agents of the government.
    ——————————————————————————–
    …most importantly, Progress
    Progress is what Liberalism really means; moral progress, economic progress, and social progress to benefit all humanity. This represents the path towards a better world. At its heart, Liberalism is an optimistic philosophy.
    http://www.turnleft.com/basics.html

  56. I think you’re right on the money. I have never lived in a more backwardly conservative place than Utah. Morality is a matter of personal opinion, as it can be as long as it is lawful and doesn’t encroach on the rights of others. But Utah is filled with people who have a fixed and prescribed notion of morality, or at least profess to have it. There is not much of a “live and let live” attitude here, too much judgment. There is a separation of church and state in theory because there has to be in every state in the Union under Federal law–but in practice that is not so evident. On what newscasts in other states does one find so many references to a single religion as in Utah, where anything connected to LDS is considered a “news item”? But scarcely anything about other religious groups in the state is ever mentioned.
    It took legislation to keep want ads out of the papers, prohibiting persons from advertising jobs and rentals with the caveat “LDS preferred” and the teaching of the Mormon faith out of the public schools. But I have still witnessed denominational prayer said in public places other than churches, by Mormons, of course. The fact remains that the Mormons, especially the older ones, still regard Utah as a Mormon state, with all things slanted toward their ways and beliefs. Are they mistaken? Well, no, not really! I hear all kinds of strange things. A woman living in a highrise, a building associated with HUD, saw that Mormons were giving denominational invocations at every common event in that highrise, even though more than half of the residents were of other faiths or none at all. Anyway, all faiths were represented there, some of which do not recognise Jesus as God. When she objected to such prayers on Constitutional grounds, she was branded an “atheist”. So I guess it was a matter of “our way or atheist”. What a narrow-minded concept, but narrow-mindedness is, in itself, a kind of religion here, reflected in statements one hears constantly. Look for a liberal here in Utah and you will probably discover a very disgruntled person who finds it hard to find people with whom he has things or ideology in common. Utah sucks the Empire State Building!

  57. I go to the University of Arizona and will be living in Ogden at a university this summer while I take an engineering internship. I grew up with a few Mormon friends, living near the second holy site, Mesa, Arizona, throughout high school. My perception of Mormons based on personal contact was pretty positive. They were friendly, stand-up kids who could be seen at a party (not drinking) but at least hanging out with their friends and not letting religion get in the way there and definitely never proselytizing “Mormonry”, as a friend of mine once eloquently put it.
    As an outsider coming into Mormon “Mecca”, I am at the same time excited and outlandishly disappointed at the prospect of having a good time in Utah. There seems to be great outdoor activities and lots of other college interns from Illinois, Colorado, and Utah to hang out with – then there are the drinking laws. Because I have secured housing in a dormitory, I have no choice but to get raped on alcohol prices at bars because even if I buy beer, I have no where else do drink it. By making it illegal to have alcohol anywhere on a university, the LDS church/Utah state government have effectively raised the drinking age above 21… and to think I turn 21 in Ogden this June.
    To those LDS in Utah whose answer is that us non-LDS should leave if we hate it so much, there is just one problem. It’s impossible to get away from the LDS when they send missionaries everywhere to hassle people. I was accosted in Tucson the other day by two suit-wearing boys in black, smiling that awkward missionary smile and asking me what my views were- the usual interlude into the attempted sale of, err, conversion to, Mormonism. If there’s one great way to be the nicest person and the world and also the most hated, it’s got to be selling your religion on a street corner.

  58. Hey Everybody!
    I’m back. I planted a couple of posts here over time. The first one posted on June 8th 2007. Funny, it seems much longer than just 8 mths. since my first post. We have lived here about 3 years and it has felt like an eternity!!!
    Good news! To the “few” who were so kind to give your opinion on how the rest of us should just get the f***k out of here. Well…..we are hysterically happy to inform you, that we are now able to take your friendly advice!
    We are moving! Yahoooooooooooo!!!
    Right now, we live in Brigham City, aka The Black Hole of this great state of Utah, also known as, A Hell Hole Of A Dust Bowl.
    We would like to say goodbye.
    Goodbye to….
    All the clinically depressed.
    The enormous amount of alcoholics, prescription drug abusers and meth users.
    All of the pushy, dangerous drivers. Especially the women. (Shame on you).
    All of the broken windshields our cars have endured from living in the land of rocks. (The windshield companies are raking in a fortune here).
    All of the staring…. deer in the headlights looks you get, just about everywhere you go, from women.
    All of the signs that say “Welcome Home Elder (fill in the blank).”
    All of the Mormons that believe that they are the only ones around here, worthy of going to heaven.
    To the woman who bumped into me at Walmart and said, “Excuse me SISTER”. (Ugh, sorry, but I am NOT LDS).
    GOODBYE to all of the bad air. Be it full of all that awful smog or dusty dirt that you breath in most of the year, that makes it so hard to breath. It makes you wonder if that’s why you see so many people here on oxygen tanks & afraid you may end up that way too if you stay here to long.
    To all of the dumbest local newscasters we have ever seen, ANYWHERE.
    All of the women in Utah who “covet” their skunk striped hair do’s.
    All of the Mormon Stepford families.
    All of the vans and suv’s with their massive amount of stick people stickers in their back windows , showing the massive amounts of children or grandchildren they have.
    Goodbye to all of the Mormons who constantly knock on peoples doors and push their religion on others, until your forced to peek out your window for months after, to see who’s there, before you open your door again to anybody.
    To all of Utah’s Mormon’s excessive & controlling rules, laws & regulations, that force you to live a very primitive way of life.
    To the lack of diversity here. Iv’e seen 5 black people and one asian in the last 3 years.
    Goodbye to the mounds of judgementalism that runs rampid here from too much of the Mormon community. (Which adds up to about 60% here in Utah).
    To all of the Mormon kids here, who get married, just so they can have sex.
    (How sad is that?)
    To all of the Mormon parents that teach their children that one of their prime objectives in life is to go out, get married young, and have lots and lots of babies.
    Cover the earth with Mormons!!!!
    Goodbye to the lack of choices when it comes to shopping here. Everything they sell in the stores for your home is either brown or black and it all looks the same. Cookie cutter decor for Utah’s cookie cutter way of living. It’s one way, and one way only! The Mormon way.
    Goodbye to all of the empty shelves, in the grocery stores. It’s pretty bad when you go to buy milk, and many times they are either out of milk or the expiration date comes due in 2 day’s. I have never experienced that anywhere else outside of Utah, and it has been common place here.
    And last, but certainly not least.
    A hearty and happy goodbye to the array of businesses that have been called to come out and fix different things at our house over the years, and they either don’t answer their phones, don’t call back, or don’t show up! We can’t figure out if their lazy, or just don’t have enough competition around to care. Or maybe you have to be Mormon to get better service. Who knows!? Anybody??????
    When we get to where we are going, I am going to kiss the ground and hug the first tree I see! Oh how I miss “trees”.
    Then we’ll join the ranks of all of the different people who originally advised us before we moved here, that moving to Utah was a reeeeally bad decision.
    The only thing I will miss about Utah is………
    Uhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm……….
    I can’t think of a damn thing!
    Words of advice to anyone thinking of moving here.
    If you are a judgemental mormon, who prefers to live life in a box.
    This place is for you!
    Everyone else…….stay far, far away!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Well, there’s a whole lot more I could say, but….
    I have to go pack! :o)

  59. I moved here about six years ago because my husband is from here and wanted to be near his ailing grandmother who raised him. Mostly I don’t pay attention to the Mormons. I’m from the East Coast and never payed much attention to the Catholics, Protestants, Atheists, Agnostics, Hare Krishnas, Moonies, Satanists, and what-have-you-theres, either. I try not to pay too much attention to the ex-Mormons because I find it hard to relate to the past/war stories, but a lot of them are my friends and I try to show my support by offering a cool, cool beer hijacked from another state.
    BUT, I do know about the stupidity. I’ve worked in jobs here where people couldn’t literally add two plus two, and they were managing other people. I’ve had contractors show up at my door who didn’t know how to read a ruler, but are somehow licensed and insured to work on my house. These clowns have done everything from hooking up a water line to a non-potable water supply, to forgetting to hook up the line to the fridge so that I had a flood in my kitchen. They inspected the house and never found the 49 glaring things wrong with the place. They put in a booster pump for a furnace backward and upside down. They put in another furnace and tried to hook up the electric to a fuse that was already overloaded. They soldered the wrong pipe in the wrong room. They hooked an electric socket to a flourescent light fixture, and forgot to wire the bathroom to the new fusebox. They installed new windows and didn’t get the right measurements. They installed new windows and didn’t wrap the window sills. They installed a water heater but didn’t install the piping correctly. They took out two feet of back yard concrete and abandoned the job because it was too muddy. They took out the concrete then dumped it all on the curb so that I could incur a nice hefty fine from the city. They took out the concrete, and half the house with it. NEED I SAY MORE.
    Yes, they can be very corrupt. Mormon, and non-Mormon alike. Here, you have to dot your i’s and cross your every t, and God help you if you are not so bright and not so assertive or even aggressive because they will take every legal and illegal advantage of you. Fortunately, I have very sharp teeth and very long claws and all the cojones any woman could ever hope to beg, borrow or steal, so they don’t f*** over me the way they do everyone else. God also help you if you have to go to court, especially small claims. The process servers don’t really serve anyone, lose your paperwork, and don’t let you know until your court date is due. The lawyers tell you they don’t need your money. They tell you the courts are not set up to give you any justice, but they are set so that you pay so much that you work it out with your neighbor, instead (right, work it out with an A-K, you mean).
    It’s very interesting being a woman here. You are not taken very seriously. Trying to buy a car, or a house, or just about anything else, they tend to talk to my husband and look right through me as if I wasn’t standing there. Which is okay because I’m the one with the money, not him. Then they wonder why we don’t bother buying anything, or calling them back.
    It’s a very strange place with some very strange people. They do stare at you an awful lot everywhere you go, that’s not made up in the posts either, it’s true, especially if you’re not Casper-ghost white with equally white hair. And it’s also true that they are horrible drivers. Yes, they tailgate like nothing I’ve ever seen anywhere else, and most of the time you drive with a bedpan beneath your bum because that’s how badly some of these freaking people can scare you. I don’t know when it became fashionable to be an a**hole but you get that a lot also, and ignorant rudeness abounds. I once went to a Tony Romas here (now defunct) and the girl who waited (?) on us refused to serve me and winked at my husband as we got up to leave, five minutes after we got there. Again, some pretty strange people exist here, but then I’ve seen some pretty strange people all over the world.
    The wages are really bad. You’d be amazed what some of these companies/businesses expect you to do for next-to-nothing, and the cost of living is really high. The real estate is out of the world, and it is true a lot of the stuff you look at as far as housing is unbelievably filthy/outdated and just plain run into the ground. There is an inordinate amount of greed–everybody has their hand out. It’s also true that there are a good deal of people who think they know it all, have horrible attitudes, are self-absorbed, and have embarrassing temper tantrums. Some of the women are hilarious in that they’re so petite and even runty, yet think they can take on the world.
    But you also meet some true gems, I mean absolutely lovely people, whether Mormon, or not, so I wouldn’t be fair in generalizing about anyone. But yes, most everything in these posts are fairly very much on the mark.

  60. holy shit. do you even live here? cause if you do it must be in one of the little hick towns that are worthless. move to downtown slc things are a lot different. and not everyone sucks here there are plenty of awesome people if you would just chill about your fuckin beer and shit. you say they are close minded well open your own fuckin mind and you might be a little more tolerated around here. study up a little bit on the LDS religion and you will see why they are so strict about things. and as far as separation of religion and state – i wanna see somewhere else that is 99 percent one religion separate its government from the beliefs of its citizens. good fuckin luck. have a good life you worthless bastard.

  61. Holy Shit? Worthless bastard? Them’s some pretty strong words for an LDS. I think you must be something confuzed. Could it be you’re in Utah? I for one live in Salt Lake City. I’ve been in hick towns down south that make slc look like a vertigo-ridden episode of Blue Velvet. I don’t know what you’re chafin’ around the groin area about, but this is all about not liking Utah here. If you’re such a Utah lover, quit being so cheap, get your own damn website and sponsor it there.

  62. UTAH SUCKS BECAUSE OF UTAH JAZZ FANS. Yes you motherfucken mormons heard it right, fucken flaming faggots.

  63. I recently visited some friends in Ogden, Ut and i love it here. The mountains are beautiful and the air is so clean. I didn’t see anything wrong with this place. I am Evangelical and moving here sounds like a good change for me. I don’t drink, i don’t smoke and God is a central part of my life.
    I noticed that the negative comments posted here are unquestioned and fully acceptable by the moderator. This is not a good place to find accurate info on Utah. I believe that in order to get a better view on any topic, there should be a equally balance of negative and positive information given. I do not believe this is the case. I can’t wait to move to Utah from Phoenix, AZ. I grew up in Los Angeles, CA, the Phoenix…. i want a peaceful, tranquil place to live, were There is a bigger focus on God. Thank you.

  64. Lily, get a clue. This is not the news, there’s no requirement for presenting a balanced view here (not that the news succeeds at that very often). You got here doing a Google search for “utah sucks,” so it’s no surprise that you’d find a bunch of people commenting on that exact subject.
    Also, a “bigger focus on God” is what causes this state to leave a bad taste in my mouth. Fortunately for me, I live in a part of Utah where there isn’t quite as big a focus on god. Honestly, I love it here and wouldn’t live anywhere else, but it would be better if people left their god out of my life.

  65. Hi,
    thank you for posting my comment. The primary reason i want to live in Utah is the focus on God and the struggle for a greater purpose. The struggle with doing the right thing and not following the crowd. The “crowd” , for me represents the world and the arrogance and corruption that is involved with progress. I will not get into it, i don’t want to impose my beliefs on you.
    Yeah, your right about this not being the news.
    I did’nt reach this page by looking up “Utah sucks”. I actually reached it by using various different phrases. I don’t remember what i used to get here, whether it was positive or negative, but i found you. I wanted to get both positive and negative things. But since my stay in Ogden, i am more certain i will be moving there soon, God willing.
    Take care, God Bless.

  66. I dislike people who are dishonest. Here are your two entries from today’s referrer log:
    68.110.88.135 – - [30/May/2008:16:41:57 -0400] “GET /archives/2001/03/utah_sucks.shtml HTTP/1.1″ 200 140185 “[Referring URL]” “Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.1.14) Gecko/20080404 Firefox/2.0.0.14″
    68.110.88.135 – - [30/May/2008:16:52:01 -0400] “POST /cgi-bin/mt/mt-comments.cgi HTTP/1.1″ 200 3779 “http://www.udink.org/archives/2001/03/utah_sucks.shtml” “Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.1.14) Gecko/20080404 Firefox/2.0.0.14″
    Sorry, I had to shorten the referring URL so that it doesn’t mess up the layout of this page. I don’t have the referrer log from your last comment because my web server only keeps logs for seven days, but I do specifically remember that you searched for “utah sucks” to find this site.

  67. Lily, one advice, why do you have to move to Utah, you live close to Tempe, a mini version of Mormon central. You don’t even have to travel that far. If you can not live in Tempe, AZ I doubt it you will find whatever you are looking for in Ogden, UT. As matter of fact Ogden is probably the less Mormon city you could find in Utah. But wait a minute you are evangelical, even worst Mormons don’t like you already. You will be seen as a competitor. See in Utah there are the Mormons and everybody else, is simple. As for you comment “The primary reason i want to live in Utah is the focus on God and the struggle for a greater purpose”. I already feel sorry for your soul. God is in one’s heart and not in geographical location.
    Also, The “crowd, for me represents the world and the arrogance and corruption that is involved with progress. Yes that progress you seem to despite is the same social progress that gave you the right to enjoy your freedom of religion many generations ago.
    That you are able to live longer, to be able to prevent diseases, to be in another part or the world in just a matter of hours, to be use the internet and be able to communicate and learn about other cultures, to be able to do research and so on, yes all these (progress) is what has made the world a better place for all of us and many generations to come.
    Please don’t sound ignorant. It just re-affirms what organized religion does to people.

  68. Hmm, everyone says once they move to Utah they hate it. But why did you move here in the first place? Everyone is way too unfair. I’m not Mormon, in fact I don’t belong to any religion. And you know what, no one cares. Everyone’s pretty open about stuff, at least where I live (Salt Lake City). Now, it may be true in other, more rural parts of the state that people are more closed-minded about things, but you know what, a lot of these reasons about why Utah sucks, like “An LDS church on every block” (which is more like an LDS church every 10 blocks) or “Beer is not sold on Sunday” (not in all the big cities in Utah where everyone lives), are not valid. And God forbid you can’t buy beer one of the seven days of the week. Sure, I like a nice beer or two, that’s why I stock up anyway (even though in the Wasatch Front where 80% of Utahns live beer is attainable on Sunday).
    Most of these reasons are antiquated. I know this isn’t a website on why Utah is great, but someone who stumbles over from another state is only going to have his/her stereotypical view on Utah (the one where the women wear 1890s clothing and no one has any electricity) intensified. Oh, and what’s this about people from Utah being stupid? Where’d this come from?
    Let’s get something straight. Utah is no Europe. I lived there for two years and Utah is definitely nothing in comparison to Hamburg. But then again, the comments made on this website by disenfranchised Mormons and other Mormon-haters are overly exaggerated.

  69. For all of you who know Star Trek, let me put things in perspective for you…
    WE ARE MORMON!
    YOU WILL BE CONVERTED!
    RESISTANCE IS FUTILE!!!

  70. I think this comment was funny: “I think Mormons are child like, they like paper cups…”
    That made me laugh for a while, think about it, and keep laughing. How can you generalize a religion right down to the paper cups? I don’t remember a Mormon president saying, “As a part of the Word of Wisdom, we all must use paper cups.” Or have they? I don’t know, I don’t watch or attend the General Confrence.

  71. I find it extremely hilarius that everyone makes fun of Utah bad mouths it and makes pretty incorrect comments about it. I have heard more racism and bigotry on this website then any other. I live in Utah and I work in the financial industry and guess what? The majority of bankruptcy cases are people that come here from out of state and are not LDS. As for being uneducated I seem to have read an article the other day that said that the high school scores for the sat’s and act’s are highest in Utah. All im saying is don’t all believe it until you have been there and don’t judge a whole religion or state by one person you know because if it was like that everyone would complain about everything. Also a comment to the admin of this site what are you thinking putting that guys ip and all his information about him up there on this site that is a true sign of no class or character. Just stop hating everyone.

  72. You work in the financial industry? Judging by your spelling and grammar, I’m guessing that you’re a janitor at a bank.
    What was I thinking by putting “that guys” IP address and “all his information” on this site? First of all, “his” name is Lily, so I doubt she’s a guy. Secondly, how else should I react when somebody calls me a liar? She refuted my statement that she reached this site by searching for “Utah sucks,” so I merely posted evidence to the contrary. In fact, I find it hilarious that you would question me posting somebody’s IP address and referring URL, when you reached this site by searching for “utah fuck buddies 801″. That’s classic! :D

  73. Interestingly I did not think of typing “Utah Sucks” onto Google until I actually escaped from Utah after a three-year “sentence” there. For all this while I thought I was alone in being convinced Utah has to one of the creepiest, most accursed and bewitched geographical locations on planet earth, until I came upon this Web site and saw there were actually plenty of others who felt the same way about this God-forsaken state as I did. Where were y’all all this time? I sure could have used your company while I was stuck rotting in that hellhole.
    One of the first things that happened to me after moving to Logan, UT was that I slipped into severe depression believing that I was now trapped for ever in the Valley of the Blind (remember that story about the guy who stumbles into a remote valley in the Andes where everybody is blind and they want him also to become blind and join their community?) That is how I see the Mormons … people who are spiritually, culturally, and intellectually blind, and want to make the rest of the planet the same way.
    As for the comments of there being a “creepy energy” and a “dark cloud of doom and gloom” hovering above this state, nothing could be closer to the truth!!! And this ONLY had to be because of all the bad karma the sick, pathologically judgmental and mentally deranged Mormon CULT had accumulated here since they showed up pushing their handcarts. I only had to land at SLC airport and I would feel the life energy seeping away from my veins, honest. I always refered to flying out of Utah as “going to America,” because for me Utah seemed not like just another country but a whole other planet, a scary and evil one at that. My boyfriend commented several times that Utah seemed like Mars in that it was such an inhospitable-looking terrain, and that it was populated by zombies who had been dropped there from a UFO or at least impregnated by aliens or something (you get my drift?) My German friend’s girlfriend came to visit (she’s Native American) and she said she could feel it in her bones that “the mountains hated the people who lived here.”
    When by God’s grace I finally got an opportunity to move out here back to the Midwest (ah, the green, beautiful Midwest … how I love seeing trees and water and NORMAL, REAL AMERICAN PEOPLE again!!!) one of my non-Mormon friends who’s stuck in Utah due to employment reasons (as I was for the past three years) said something very poignant to me … he said “The fact that you have been able to escape from here gives me hope that I too will be able to find a way out from this hell.” Folks, he’s not exaggerating … Utah has a way of sucking you in and draining you of all hope of ever being able to leave, it is strange but true (and a testament to the place’s CREEPY, TOXIC ENERGY). But all those of you who are hoping to leave, please keep trying, and one day you will be able to release yourself from the clutches of the monster…

  74. I moved to Utah 15 years ago, and I was too young at the time to know better or object to this move. There’s some good, and definitely bad, things about Utah. The scenery is good–mountians, deserts, and some women folk. The bad seems to come mainly from the culture here. I’ve lived in several counties, and some are very different from eachother. I didn’t notice a whole lot of oddities about the state of Utah until I moved to Utah County.
    I’ve lived in Utah County for 3 years to finish school, and will have to stay another few ’till graduation, and I’m half-dreading this. I’ve never experienced such a severe dysfuntional society/culture before.
    I’ve been bluntly discriminated for jobs because I refused to answer if I was a “returned missionary of the LDS church” or not during an interview–that I ended up walking out on. Teachers at state or government-run institutions will start talking about the LDS church during class, and they’ll talk about it as if anyone knows what the devil they’re talking about.
    I’ve experienced alot of what seems like “religiously-influenced” nepotism, stereotyping, biggotry, favoritism, prejudice, exclusion, debasing, ostentatious friendliness, two-faced personalities, and discriminating behavior. But that’s all it is–just bad behavior.
    I don’t think anybody here are really bad people. They’ve probably been influenced to think and behave this way doe to the severely conforming, religious attitude of this culture.
    I plan on getting the hell outta’ Dodge when I finish college, and never look back. But until then, all I can do is avoid stepping in the bullshit of this religious culture, mind my own business and my sanity, and protect my own personality.
    Signed,
    A non-mormon.

  75. Duuude, Escapee, you make it sound like once you come into Utah, you can’t get out of it. From what I can tell, they let you move in and out of the state as much as you want. Right? Well, I’ve never tried moving out, but I’ve been out of the state lots of times, and for all they care I could’ve been moving, right?

  76. Utah sucks. It really does.
    This place exists in its own little vacuous, soul-draining, cultural island.
    The religious fanatics are the worst, and the culture they breed here is the most detrimental, anti-humanistic thing I’ve ever seen.
    What someone said in an earlier post is true, this place does have a “creepy, toxic energy” about it.
    I think it’s interesting how this state tries to claim itself to be the safest, best place to live, but yet they have some of the highest statistics in: Meth labs, alcoholism, divorce, bankruptcy, foreclosures, depression, suicide, and anti-depressant prescriptions.
    Everything about this state seems plastic and two-faced. The only thing decent about Utah is its strong support of family values, and its geology.

  77. Sweet sweet Utah ignorance. It reminds me of those baptists who condemn people to hell if they’re not one. These assholes originally believed in multiple marriages, and believe the “prophet” constantly is in communication with god. “And yea god told me today that plural marriage is bad, oh yeah, and since it is the mid-70′s I guess we’ll have to let those negroes into our church.” It’s the most transparent religion I’ve ever seen.
    Joseph Smith saw God and Jesus, therefore he has to be a prophet. Hold it. Are they sure this wasn’t a magic mushroom-induced hallucination? From what I recall, no one has ever seen God in the history of all fucking mankind. Science will set us free. Damn near all the wars in civilization were, or are caused by ignorance and religion. So Mormons, get off that racist, ignorant, judgmental pedestal that you feel so comfortable on. And Utah, you’re not changing because you’re inhabitants are too stupid, so just continue on with your ruling of this fascist state, and see what happens. Free your mind, free your soul.
    P.S.- funny how LDS is so close to LSD. Perhaps a subliminal message?

  78. Everything people are saying about the culture here in Utah is fucking true down to the marrow. Christ in a sidecar, people really do live oblivious to the real world.
    Their younger members are the most ignorant, intolerant, prejudice people ever. I’ve had to move three times in three years because of them.
    And if you’re in your 30′s and single and non-mormon, you will have no social life, and you will be marked as a “menace to society.”

  79. This is “Escapee” again, responding to the question by “Anon” above. Anon asks why I sounded in my previous post like I “couldn’t get out of” Utah and was unable to leave. Simply because that is how the cookie crumbles when you work in academia as a tenure-track faculty … alternative similar openings are few and far between, and don’t come by everyday. Until then, you are stuck in your current position (as I was) until you are blessed with a new job offer (as I was, eventually) … unless, of course, you are willing to quit your position anyway and subsequently risk unemployment/homelessness/hunger/lack of medical care etc. etc. Remember, this is America, there is no social safety net here, so you don’t give up a secure job with benefits until you actually have another one to go to. Especially if you plan to live indoors and not eat out of garbage cans.

  80. lol, as many of those whom read this forum can read and see, “us” whom truly understand why this place sucks, have been given even more reason by “them” whom post their ignorant comments in defense of this disgusting culture as to why the people of Utah are indeed much more void of any brain power than most. And as one can see, none have posted any valid proof of their defense…….and the few whom did, where proven to be full of shit, or too cowardly to provide ANY argument or conclusive evidence as to why Utah DOES NOT suck total absolute ass. xD
    Now, I will begin MY story of Utah life.
    I am from Tennessee and in my experience, I have been truly and utterly disappointed with my whole experience with Utah culture and lifestyles and I feel tortured and raped by this disgusting place of abhorration.
    I moved to Ogden, Utah about 2 years ago from Knoxville, TN with high hopes of achieving a new life and fresh ideals, the mountains where abound, the place looked beautiful, there where national parks stretched across the maps within 4 hrs distance as far as the eye could see. There was actually a decent public transportation system, which Knoxville had no such thing. In Tennessee if you don’t have a car, you’d better have a friend who does xD unless you are Lance Armstrong and you’re ready to bike the Tour De Tennessee. So to cut all this stuff short, I couldn’t wait to get the hell out of Knoxville, and go somewhere new……..and meet new people and experience a new lifestyle maybe. I thought it would be great to get away from the Bible belt, and away from any kinds of religious fanaticism, which I know, Utah=Mormons, but Mormons there weren’t so damn clanny.
    So I get to Utah, I was so happy, and it was so wierd looking, coming up through the canyons was a beautiful drive……….then I get to Ogden…………..xD……….I thought I had just driven back into some East Tennessee ghetto, except, there where no black people……….just white people and Mexicans………mostly the kind that look like they just bought everything they own at Wal-Mart, from the flourescent/rainbow-colored/Nascar/redneck/inbreed section. xD Anyways, aside from my last judgemental comment, crackhead/meth-addict lookin’ folk. People that back home, would’ve lived in some backroad-neighborhood called a “Holler”.
    Anyways, my rent was gonna be $275 a month with no-utility cost……I thought that was great! I thought the houses and everything here in Utah would be clean and new and all that jazz since a bunch of white elitist Mormons ran the state……….o boy…….did I have another thing coming or what!
    My new room looked like a jail cell with carpet added on. I think that a 5 year old child carpenter made the roofing for that room. And the air conditioning vents…..NOT PRIVATE……..at all. You could hear everything upstairs from my crappy little jail-cell room. Same the other way around. The house on the add was to be shared between 3 guys downstairs, my age, and girls would get upstairs….MIS-informed……….my landlord was using upstairs when I got here, and was soon to be moving out to get married and have a new house. Well, he ended up taking the first offer that was given and moved a single LSD mother with her 5 year old child. Great, 3 college age men, and a single mother trying to make this house into her own little LSD gathering center for children!! Thanks a lot Landlord!! Then all I ever hear is little kids screaming all the time…………….xD yippie…………when I moved in, I was told that the drive-way was to be shared by all tenants, and that we where to work it out betwixt ourselves…………MIS-informed………..New LSD tenant upstairs brings in complaints about me smoking cigarettes OUTSIDE (whilst also remaining clean about my butts and such), and complains cause I parked my car in the back of the driveway (PLENTY of room for her) for a couple days because the streets in Ogden are curved at a 90 degree angle on the outside cause they pave them in about 10 seconds, so my car doesn’t register the gas that I have, even if I have 5 gallons in it, and I cannot start it from there in the street, so it’s like I’m out of gas, even when I’m not. So I have no extra money to buy gas, and I have to park in the street, and just go without my car until I can save for more. So basically this LSD woman, takes over the entire house from under our noses, and makes us feel as though we are not at home…….in our OWN HOME! Landlord was on her side every single time, no matter what the cause because, I assume, she was the highest paying bidder so to speak.
    totally got screwed on that deal, and moved in with the girl I started dating there, which is a WHOLE nother story, that actually bleeds the case of Utah’s drug-addicts and poor-welfare payed prescription abusers and single mothers squirting out babies every 9 months as much as possible, but I care not to go THAT far with my post, as this would take a month to type! lol
    Now jobs, I was hired at Chuck-A-Rama Buffet as my first job here which was DOMINATED by women might I add. I enjoyed that job for my first 2 months here and was happy to be working somewhere close to home. I was hired on as a server there…………….never ONCE served a table…………..they told me, “next Tuesday” every time I asked when am I going to start serving tables. They kept me on the cash register that entire time and I stopped asking eventually when I will be a server………….I was starting to get good at my cashiering job, came in early every-day, clean uniform, good mood………….I was getting perfect and NEAR perfect tills for about a week until, I looked at the schedule at the end of the shift one night, and noticed my schedule was clear for the next week I was thinking “?????????” what? My manager tells me I am suspended for a week………….still don’t understand why……so I keep asking and telling them that all they need to do, is tell me directly, what I am doing wrong, and what to do right, and I will do it. I dont mind critisizm at all, especially if it is understood……it IMPROVES the process of work…….but they never would give me a reason……..no reason at all, I simply wasn’t doing anything wrong at all……….so they had no reason……….they seemed MORE dumbfounded that I even asked than anything. I told my boss, “If I am annoying, tell me, If you don’t like me, tell me, whatever it is, please somebody have the guts to just tell me a real reason, then I will know, and I will be able to correct the problem, or at least know what the problem is”………………….no reason given……..so I got teary eyed cause my feelings where hurt….I enjoyed the job and was having a good time, and I thought I was doing a great job!………..it hurts when you think you couldn’t be doing better, and somebody suspends you without reason, and won’t tell you why. So I finally got through to them and she put me back on the schedule but never told me what I did wrong, except, told me,”give less personality”?
    So I started working again with the thought,”mybe I am annoying or something and I don’t know it…….I guess I’ll just mind my business even more, and just do the essential functions of my job and nothing else.”
    1 week later, got fired AFTER my shift that evening…………..no reason given, they just didn’t “need” me anymore. Had to pay rent a week later, and didn’t have the money yet. Thanks Chuck-A-Rama!
    so I had to go to Burger King and get payed 7 bucks an hour cause I needed money really fast. Then more hell starts.
    By the Way, my bathroom at my “jail” like setting home, had a BIG GIANT hole in the roof when I moved in that you could see through to upstairs through msaller holes in the big one, in 1 and 1/2 years, NOT FIXED or even worked on AT ALL! Then a pipe that my landloard had fixed himself to the main, busted, I had woke up about 11 in morning and had a FLOWING RIVER going down my hallway, only to create a Large Basin of water in my living room. Then the toilet blew up, and sprayed water everywhere, then had no toilet for a week. I HAD TO BUY THE NEW TOILET!! My landlord never ever took out of the expenses for any of this……….KNOWING that I would not want to waste the time and money on court……..THAT is how Utah people are……They will rape you and molest you, and hurt you, as long as they know they can. If you’re poor, you’re fucked in Utah.
    So, since, I have been through the worst living hell I have ever before encountered in my entire existence when I lived in Ogden with my girlfriend and all the Crackheads she knew, meth-heads, hospital prescription addicts, and bums. I couldn’t get out! I was stuck in poorness. Mexicans had better chances of getting jobs than I did there. There’s LOTS of people that need LOTS of help, and not enough jobs to keep up.
    I couldn’t even cash any of my paychecks out here cause I didn’t have 2 forms of I.D., and my bank was in TN……..which turned out to need 10 bucks from me before they would withhold “account-abuse” status on me so that I could get a bank here, so I could have my OWN money.
    Everything here requires a damn background check or some other kind of status quo check.
    You’re treated like a criminal before you’re treated like a citizen.
    Never before have I ever felt like or been treated like and “immigrant” in any other state I’ve lived in.
    I could go to the ghetto in Atlanta Georgia and be treated better, and I’m white!
    Now I am stuck living in my father’s house after a long experience of living with girlfriend. Embarrassing, I am 25 years old, and I’ve never had a harder time getting a damn job ANYWHERE. I had one at Applebee’s in Riverdale for 2 weeks and was fired on the spot when I asked how to ring up a side of Macaroni and Cheese properly, the manager wanted me to charge them for a whole extra entree, when the customer asked for “a side”, so I told her I was ringing in a side…………it was about a 10 second argument, which I did not contest, but was fired right there, in front of everyone, just for that, based on a manager’s whim. Can’t figure that one out either, cause that was ANOTHER job I was doing fantastically well at, but got fired without cause, BY A WOMAN.(a really over-weight butt-faced one too!) xD
    Now I cannot get any people or jobs to be upfront with me or give me any kind of REAL answer about anything really at all. I’ve realized this about Utahns, they DO NOT EVER tell you the truth to your face. EVER.
    People out here never, ever, ever, work anything out in an honest way……it’s more like a shallow, scared, hidden path to seek for answers with people here…….you have to find out through hear-say……..which is already sketchy to begin with………but thats about all I can get out of people………..is what they tell OTHER people to tell me…….xD
    Anyways, I’ve been reading this forum for so long, and typing this message and thinking about it so long now, I am too lazy to really lay it all out.
    In any case, my experience in Utah is this: Utah=Hell on Earth
    sorry to sound so negative, the nature is beautiful, but I agree with almost everyone else here, Utah people are ignorant, they can’t build ANYTHING worth a shit, they STARE TOO GOD DAMNED MUCH!!! the girls ARE whores with 20 children a peice and skunk-hairdoos, the culture is lacking of morals, manners, standards, class, and honesty. There’s more nigg-wanna-be’s and 2pac look alikes than anywhere ever, but there’s like 2 ebonic people in this whole state. Ironic.
    There IS a creepy energy here, and the mountains DO hate the people here.
    Mormons in Utah DO live in Oxymormon land with their double standards.
    And I have been ostracized by everyone I’ve met here as of yet.
    Thank you Utah for teaching me what REALLY sucks in life, and showing me how to truly appreciate the things I once had and have learned, and for being raised somewhere better than this crap.
    * poop on Utah and all it’s culture*
    ~Dalfurion~

  81. Let me say it one more time, I HATE Utah more than anywhere in the entire world that I’ve ever seen. Never before have I ever seen a place where it’s almost impossible to get your foot in the door, and get the hell out of poverty. Once you’re here, you’re stuck, as long as you can possibly be stuck. Because you can’t make an extra dollar for yourself to spend or save no matter what you do when you’re getting paid the lowest wages in the entire country, and jobs are as flaky as crackheads. People here do not care one way or another for anyone else unless they can use them somehow. Whatever you do, DO NOT come to Utah unless you have enough money to get back OUT. Because it’s almost impossible to get back OUT. BTW, nobody here values Bookstores? WTF is you peoples’ problem? I will throw the biggest party I’ve ever thrown the day I escape this hellhole and rue the day I entered into it. I’ve never had more bad luck, and more bad experiences EVER. So, to those dumbass Utah-ans that say, “well, if you don’t like it, leave”, I say, “F- YOU, I would if I COULD, but in a place where they treat Mexicans better than they do Americans, I CANT, ELSE I WOULD BE GONE RIGHT NOW!!!”

  82. Someone else’s religion is none of my business, but when that someone else starts acting stupid, and intolerant towards me because I don’t share their religious beliefs, well that’s when the shit hits fan.
    You don’t disrespect people because they’re different.

  83. I think I’m suffering from that same spell Utah seems to cast on some people. After a while, you do start to lose interest in leaving–even if you subconsciously know better. I want to stay here because Utah seems like a nice, comfortable place to live, and in some ways and places, that’s true. In other ways it’s not.
    I think Utah has as many problems as any other state, but people here seem to hide it better. There’s a subliminal, conforming attitude with people here to be perfect, and perfectly just, and perfectly happy, and, well, perfectly religious.
    Everybody’s on a rat-race to get to heaven, I guess.
    The predominant religion here does have a very large presence and influence on this state, but then again, that’s true for other religions in other parts of the world in other parts of history, too.
    I was kind of freaked out by the culture here in Utah, too. The first thing I noticed was that there’s not a whole lot of diversity here . . . yet. (I think the dominant Latin immigration into Utah is inevitably going to change that–for the good) There’s definitely very little religious diversity. The LDS church does have a backwoods influence on city and state affairs–which is unethical, I think. That seems to be changing, though. As the administrator of this blog noted up top, some cities are beginning to “modernize” their laws and ordinances, and are trying to catch Utah up to modern times. I think a lot of people are trying to “modernize” Utah, and broaden its culture, and this state seems to be resistant and defiant about it in a way.
    Like, for example, I was watching the news a few days ago about a big land development deal to build three New-York sized skyscrapers in Sandy. The Utah news anchorman who was covering the story kept repeating over-and-over-and-over-and-over again about how these new building are going to be larger than the LDS Church office building and the LDS Church’s temple.
    I think Utah does live in a bubble, and that people here act like the world revolves around the LDS church. I think this state is slowly–very, very slowly–catching up to the rest of the world.
    But in the mean time, all I can only do is enjoy my own non-LDS life, and not get “sucked in”–as a lot of other non-LDS people have told me.

  84. First off, I have lived here for 8 years…and even the local burning man community here is like the rest of the state: 15% cool people and 85% f*ktards.
    Although most people could say that 85% of the burning man festival in it’s 20th + year reincarnation is mostly F*tards, but that is another topic.
    Let me have my rant…I deserve it!
    I have put in my time and own a business and have to put up with you self centered idiots (and kind expats of other states and resaonable humans in general) so let me have this rant and make your comments about what YOU have to say not about what I have to say…unless of course you will agree with me.
    UTAH
    If you grow up here you are pressured from day one to be perfect….
    and that teaches you to be a perfect backstabber.
    If you want to get ahead here you have to learn the subtle languages of the uptight, the incredibly illiterate, the down right willfully ignorant and the stoic business freak that is probably wearing a plug in his butt under those slacks and then there is the “scared of brown people” smiling monkey mormons who in trying to be “good” interact with “different” people as an alternative to astral travel.
    HOW TO BE A JACK MORMON MORON because no one is talking about the real problem here…the halfbaked humanoids known as ……the apostate OR jack mormon…correct my reference church wenches and I will send you nasty images telepathically! “IT” seems like a normal human but in a month or two you will see the flicker of animatronic hardware under the skin or in the back of the eyes…these are the kind that can repeat a manifesto of self awareness but not write one.
    OK…HOW TO BE A SLACKER JACK MORMON
    1. Grow up in or convert to “the church” and then ditch it for whatever reason.
    Those reasons can be anything from getting too much special attention from a certain elder or being #11 in a family of 12 kids and getting forgotten as a regular habit or just waking up one day and asking WHY and not being able to stop.
    THE FIRST MISTAKE AT THIS POINT IS TO REMAIN IN UTAH
    2. DEclare that religion is mind control and then become, in serial, pagan then buddist then tibetan buddist then mayan calendar officianado (discovered during an exploratory trip to california), sprinkle a little bit of bullshit philosophy that supports your unwilingness to be direct and honest….”what IS truth, man?” Then douse your guts in DMT, Iawoska (sp?), Ketamine and Heroin and cocaine….maybe some booze and pot too. Utans are bigger pot heads than all the residents of humbolt county ca combined.
    3. Find the local http://www.burningman.com festival, element 11, because you NEED to GO NUTS and drugs and group sex is the way to go. Attend it and get really wasted on E so that you can experience human touch, finally…only to wake up between a 60 + year old leather skinned bi sexual event producer and his equally leather skinned wife…eeeeeeeeeeeeeeew uh that was NOT me but it is a gross, true story and the lady involved wishes that she could boil her skin off.
    4. Take a bath in 10% solution of bleach and vow to never do THAT again.
    5. Start getting depressed that you are not cool enough, go to parties to only find out that the name of the game is boinking as many other humans as possible…BUT wait, it is Utah and reeks of polygamy rules…the males get to hump as many girls as they want and so do the girls. “I thought it would make him happy…..” Barbie is alive and well..her head is carved from a solid mass of synthetic material of unknown origin…
    6. Become polyamorous so that all the cool people think you are detached and specaial like them…and get into all the “good” parties with the “good” drugs and contract a good case of the official Utah state viral skin condition pandemic …genital warts aka HPV. In utah you can’t talk about what you are doing because that means you are doing it so lets just do it and not talk about it….by the way those bumps on my wee wee are just skin tags…don’t worry.
    7. Get the shit scared out of you in the free clinic…creepy mormons examining your wee wee….strange! Decide to become a monk and go annoy the people at the Kanzeon Zen center in SLC. Get the buddist boot since you are really stil neuortic and it has only been a few years since you left behind the warmth and permanence of knowing for sure what happens to you after you die.
    8. Decide to become a shaman and go annoy people at temple square.
    9. Figure out how to pay rent, because along with your church training you threw out all convention and common sense because you were taught all or nothing and that is how you operate and you have no job since that requires being clean. taek a shower, call relatives for money and go see the old bishop to get him to buy your groceries and pay your rent. Use parental money for drugs while stating how much your parents sucked for making you emotionally toxic.
    10. Have some fun…Put on some plain clothes that cover up from the neck to the knees and go shopping on sunday and act like you are mormon, look for other “mormons” keep semi/avoidance style eye contact with other “mormons”, who are also “not” shopping on sunday.
    11. Stab all of your friends in the back because it feels good to just get it out after making it all the way through seminary without killing anyone.
    12. Find your way back to Provo and shoot some heroin in your mom’s basement, borrow money.
    13. Go swimming on sunday and let the “devel swirl the dark waters around your legs and privies”. Call bishop and ask for more $$ since you spent you last $50 on some pot and 3.2 beer and 2 gallons of gas so that you don;t have to walk 2 blocks to the “sev” (utahn for 711).
    14. Dress like a human, talk like a human, but someday you will have to say or write sell and it will come out of you as sale and you will be discovered.
    15. humliated that you cannot stop being a sheep you return to your sheepdom, it is predictable and “safe”.
    Communicating: How to tell the truth – lie by omission.
    Courting: cling tightly and then stalk.
    Selling or “sale-ing or Its for sell: put some scammy stolen stuff on KSL and sell it an old lady who might even be your aunt but who cares because heavenly father will take care of her needs.
    Buying: pretend that you do not have any cash on you but try to talk the sale-er down anyway just as an exercise in asserting because you know you will neve be as direct as you think you are and by god you WILL take you shot out on the retailers in town as much as you want!
    The average Utah man…..back stabbing and incredibly homely, most of them. The average Utah woman…back stabbing and looks like barbie and talks slow with a whine…that is the sound of the pigs ears trying to pop forward out of the pins.
    I love it when a big car full of mormons rolls by and their kids are all climbing out of the suburban window…..wanna know how ya got here kids? ! Ask yer bishop!
    AH, that is better.
    now I did not comment on the other environmental issues or other politically church controlled shit because it is so obvious that when the new is on and they “the church” as if there were only one.

  85. Just saw on the news today that the state of Utah will be banning wine coolers, and even the ones that aren’t banned have to plainly say “Contains alcohol” on the label.
    One of the wine cooler companies is actually refusing to do business with Utah anymore.
    Don’t even try to argue with me that the LDS Church doesn’t have anything to do with this.
    Don’t even try.
    Bloody state.

  86. Well our 3 year sentence to Utah is OVER!!! PLEASE talk to as many people as you can before you move to this state. All the bad things you will here about , multiply by 10 for yourself, then by 20 for your kids.
    What a wonderful CULT they have here, read up on it because they will not tell you about it. The further I dig into it, the more it reminds me of one of my 1st computer games……..LEMMINGS.
    Arrogance,ignorance,inbreeding,multiple-wives,some as young as 14, planet kolob when you die, if this sounds good to you move to Utah ASAP.
    Bob Hannah

  87. First of all, people here are cowards. They love to do shit to you under cover of darkness, like leave trash and tires on your curbside, or spray gibberish on your property. They will also try to start something with you, then immediately back off when you call their bluff.
    Second of all, people here are frauds. This place is crawling with them. They falsify their resumes and claim to have credentials they don’t . You think you’re getting a construction expert, a real estate professional, an accountant, an attorney, what have you, and what you’re really getting is some clown that’s either related to someone or that someone just felt sorry for. Nowhere does caveat emptor apply more than here.
    Third of all, these are some of the most hateful, sinister little people you will ever meet anywhere. You look at them and they have those permanent hate scowls etched in their features. When they get old, especially, you can see that mask of hate as clearly as a plaster cast. When they’re not squinting and scowling at you, they’re giving you those half-baked, half-smiles that are either the result of a Botox overdose or too much trapped gas. I’m not sure which, but either way it looks pretty stupid.
    Lastly, they are some scary little people in the sense that you give them any amount of power and they will abuse it and use it to Lord supreme over you. Stay away from hospitals here if you can, law venues, God forbid, jail, and anywhere where sadistic little people have free reign. Just as pedophiles like to set up foster homes and daycare centers so they can be around children, sadistic f***s like to set up shop in hospitals and other venues where they can see people suffering or else inflict their own sick little brand of suffering. There is a lot of that here, too.
    Also, boys and girls, fret not that other people disapprove of and criticize you for daring to be as singly individual as you are. Remember: opinions are like hemorrhoids, every asshole has one. Give them back their half-baked little smiles and move on.

  88. Fuckn shit, all of these people are some god damn narrow minded fuck holes
    hey i know how to make my day better lets go online and bash utah and
    the mormons, fucking serioulsy? come on man, you know i recently moved
    here from california ,LA none the less and i like it a lot here, funny cause im
    not mormon and im so pissed by what everyones saying about it, you people
    have no fucking clue whats its like to be in a bad area, man back in cali i was
    fucking jumped 4 times just walking around at night, i was mugged in daylight
    i almost got stabbed in school even, and i have had my share of dealing with
    assholes literally on a daily basis, people here fucking nice way nicer than
    anyone back home and all the mormons are really cool, they know im not lds,
    they dont constantly try to convert me, they dont shun me from their conversations, the mormons have helped me so much, i was fucking dead broke
    out here and the bishop from my moms church hooked me up with a job and not
    only that but my job is even paying for me to fucking go to school, yeah its
    like a scholarship i didnt even earn, you wont get that back home, all theyll say
    is hey its not my problem, now you probably think im just a dumbass but i lived
    in california for 21 years born and raised and i dont miss it at all, sure its got a
    lot to do and its awesome for entertainment and i know utah is dead boring
    but i still love it here, i like the fact that i can walk down the street and not
    have to look over my shoulder constantly and i like the fact that i can say
    hi to someone on the street and they say hi back instead of mad dogging me
    or telling me to fuck off, for the people that were born here you have no god
    damn reason to hate this place, why dont you go to inglewood LA and see
    how far you get there, and for the people that moved here and hate everyone
    lds, get a fucking life, dont hate someone because you think their religion is a bunch of fucking crazy cultists, you want to talk cultists you go down to hollywood and talk to one of them wierd ass scientology motherfuckers, then youll see what crazy is, sure there is some shit i dont like about utah, for
    one the wages are too low and there isnt that many places for work, and the
    people are kinda slow witted, and its hard to find girls that arent already
    married or pregnant, but that can all be overlooked, i just cant believe how
    misinturpeted the lds religion is, everyone thins that they dont believe in
    jesus and they worship their prophet, bullshit, thats all they ever say is
    our saviuor jesus christ this and our saviour jesus christ that, they are as
    christian as can be, its funny how you say all there is are lds churchs, bullshit
    yet again, theres quite a few christian churches in my area. I also think
    its funny how you say mormons are cultists and paligimists and theyre sick
    not true, paligimist are a different breed, sure they might have been started
    off of lds religion but they are fucking whacked out and the strayed very far
    from reality, mormons dont even asscosiate with them at all, and it funny yet
    again how every hates mormons calling them this or that and they are fucking
    crazy, but now one care when the catholics rape little boys, sure hate all you
    want but i can fucking really care less what any of you think, you all had a few
    bad expirences here and there and you completely think that thats how everyone in utah is, fucking rdiculious.

  89. i live in utah, its terrible somebody get me out of here. i lived here for over 5 years and i hit my limit. those arrogant mormon assholes trying to brainwash everyone and make your lives miserable! im not mormon and i never go near a mormon church, God forbid.

  90. Mormon people worship their culture as much as they worship their religion.
    I respect their religion, but come on, they act like their culture is like the eleventh commandment, and if you don’t conform to it, you’re treated like a subversive parasite. There’s no God or humanity in treating people like that. I know, because I’ve experienced this myself.
    I see people all the time around me succumbing to the effects of the golden cow they call the Mormon Culture. It’s creepy. It drains your personality. It shelters a sheltered existence. It entraps people, and tricks them into thinking that they can’t live outside of Utah, or that they can’t survive without the Mormon church. Talk about codependency issues. I’m beginning to understand why Utah has so many problems with alcohol, and drugs, and meth, and bankruptcy, and divorces. I mean, shit on a shingle. How many vices do they experiment with here? Why go to Vegas, it’s all here in the woodwork.
    It reminds me of The Stepford Wives story, where everything is not what it really appears to be. Utah is like the Beverly Hills of religion. It’s all glitz and religious glamour and perfectly happy appearances, but when you take a closer look at the faces, you see how synthetic and fabricated things really are. You would also see that the only thing holding all of this up is their secret garden of addictions to porn, sex, alcohol, drugs, and anti-depressants. Without them, the botox and implants fall off.
    A lot of people are right about Utah in that there’s a lot of good things about this place, but the culture here tends have the same affect that the inversion has on the sky–it fucks up the view, and makes it hard to breath.
    I’m not afraid of Utah–I’m only afraid of what its culture can do to people. I’m afraid of what it almost did to me.

  91. Yes this place sucks, I am retired Air Force and stayed here to allow my son to finish high school. This place caused my divorce, my retirement, my kid is now a straight edge Utah asshole just like everyone else here. Utah women are dumber than anyone I have ever met in 7 other countries and 12 other states I have lived in. Utah men are total idiots and need their asses kicked daily to deflate their pompous heads. I am outta here when kid graduates high school and if this state gets wiped off the map the U.S. will be a better place. Utah refuses to be a part of the U.S. and is living in another world. The LDS church runs everything here and is two faced.

  92. i am the single most anti-Utah person in existance, and was forced to spend a week in little nowhere towns for a week on a road trip family vacation, the people i saw were nice, but i diddnt leave my best westerns much, which were the closest things to civilization i had, so i dont know much about that… BUT IT IS SO FREAKING BORING!!! THERE IS NOTHING APPEALING ABOUT IT! ITS JUST ROAD, ROCKS, ROAD, TOWN RINSE AND REPEAT!!!!! I have never been more suicidal in my life, i think we should give it back to mexico personally :P

  93. The social life in Utah can be depressing if you’re not LDS. Alot of them only like to be around other LDS people, or around people they think can be converted. This gets worse the closer you live to Orem.
    Yeah, the religious culture here is weird, and odd, and needs to catch up to the rest of the real world.

  94. Well, I live in what can technically be considered ” Paradise. ”
    Deerfield Florida, I love it here, and even though we have high crime here in Broward county, and a shortage of jobs, and monies rough, I wouldnt leave here unless they dragged me out kicking and screaming…
    And why am I so attached to this place ? Because ive been to Utah, and I know what hell is.
    I spent eleven of the most miserable months of my life in SLC, and I will NEVER , no matter how much money is involved next time, EVER go back to that fucking hell hole.
    I hate Utah on a deeply personal level.
    I am Hispanic, and in a long term relationship with a great gal who I havent married yet, and man, did we get judged.
    I had never felt so alienated in my life, and I lived in the Boonies in Kentucky!
    These people made me and my gal feel likel outsiders.
    We were stared at, gawked at, shunned, only because we flat out refused to be indoctrinated into their cult.
    I remember one time, I was in a Walmart, and I had a cell phone call from my mother, I spoke to her in Spanish at first, and said ” Whats up Mamasita ” and this one guy looked at me with a disgusted/angry scowl, now, Im not a violent man by any means, but at that exact moment I guess Utah had finally broken me, I couldnt help but ask ” What the fuck are you staring at, asshole ? ”
    He looked away almost immediately, and thats when I knew I had to get the fuck out of there, I had never in my life been confrontational towards anybody, and if that guy had said something even remotely off color I probably wouldve wanted to kill the poor bastard.
    Utah has a way of making you…. crazy.
    Its literally like living in the Poltergeist home, the dark energy there is creepy, its sort of like walking around a living Twilight Zone episode, everything seems human and normal, yet somehow, in the pit of your stomach, you know its not.
    Its like your body, or your ” soul ” or conscience knows that the place is strange, the people give off this vibe, theyre like a hive.
    The whole place fucking sucks.
    And boy am I glad I left, I will NEVER go back there, EVER again, in my life.

  95. I moved to Utah from Maryland back in October and I’m loving it. I had secretly dreamed of living in Utah, ever since I found out via lds.org how many stakes were there. Orem has 24 stakes, which is over double the number in the entire state of Maryland. By the time I actually entered Utah for the first time, I recognized the names of almost every town going down 15 from staring at a map of Utah so much.
    The first day here, me and my friend went to the distribution center so he could get some garments. Meanwhile, I just walked around staring, in awe, at all the church stuff in one place. I got to take him to the MTC a week later, my first MTC experience ever.
    I can sing the primary song “I love to see the temple” driving on 15, while actually seeing a temple in some places. When I get my temple recommend, I will go temple hopping before I drive back to Maryland to drop the car off with my dad, and then fly back for the MTC. Mormon girls are everywhere, too bad I’m a pre-missionary. Once I get back here after my mission, the game is on.

  96. K first off Im not mormon for one and most mormon people are nice u assholes just need to get to know them better k yeah there are some mormon assholes that put mormons into a bad name same with every religion 2 u dumb fucks…and i like living in utah maybe all the alcholics and druggies should get the hell out along with the assholes that put mormons into bad names and go shoot themselves.I dont care what religion u are and maybe if ur a loser who likes to drink on sunday good for u learn how to get liver disease and be gone bitch..Im latin love living here and think all the retarded dumb people should get out and im glad most of u bitches dont like living here more space for me to get less annoyed with the retard’s around me…later bitches

    1. You say to get to know LDS people and try to accept them, then you judge someone for drinking on Sunday and wish them a miserable disease? Then you tell people with legitimately bad experiences and legitimately bad opinions of the local culture in general to leave?
      The irony.

  97. What everybody is saying about this place is true.
    Jesus wept, I’ve been here too long.
    Fifteen years, and all I have to show for it is an empty ball sac.
    You’ve gotta’ have a strong mind if you want to survive here, otherwise it will make you soft.
    My own experiences with living here are the aggressive drivers, materialistic lifestyles, the judgemental cloud that hangs over this place, and not enough diverse culture to make people well-rounded.

  98. I ran into this page doing a Google search on some immigration issues in Utah. To be frank, this entry resembles a lot of hate sites put up by White Supremacists, Neo-nazis, and the like. I am a “Mormon,” a member of the LDS Church. I am from Texas. I am finishing up school in Utah. Let me just say that I don’t like living here, either. Though I may share something in common with you, I still feel like some of the posters are bat-shit crazy. It’s a hypocritical approach to call a group of people out for not being accepting, and then promote a general feeling of hatred to them. The dislike I have of this state comes from both fellow members of the LDS Church and those who aren’t.
    I think the general attitude in Utah that makes it so difficult to deal with for many is one of isolationism. As an early people, many of us came to Utah to escape persecution (there was a law in Missouri that only recently got rescinded that said it was legal and encouraged to shoot Mormons on sight, for example), because our communities represented economic competition. A lot of it originated in the fact that ministers were outraged that we drew their congregations to ours, since that’s where they get their livelihood, and we don’t pay our ministers. Sure, we like many did some horrible things to the indigenous inhabitants in Utah. We also did some wonderful things. Your ancestors are just as guilty if not more so. Hatred of us was made possible, at the individual level, by fear, hatred, etc. The early promoters of anti-Mormonism (not anti-Mormon Church; anti-Mormon person) exploited all of this to see to many of this people’s misfortunes.
    Why do I share that bit of information? This cultural isolationism that makes it easy for so many people be racist, sexist, and otherwise bigoted, fearful of the outside, has a source. Any cohesive group of people with similar or uniform values, marginalized, tend to bite back, for better or for worse. The fact that our religion is unfamiliar and has been vilified by the extremist “Christian RIght (to which so many pitiful, dog-like Utahns still pander)” and more recently by angry, non-religious types makes it easier to hate us. Do I think this is everybody else’s fault? No. I think most social problems are everyone’s fault.
    Let me tell you that LDS culture outside of the various Utah “bubbles” is very different. The majority of Mormons don’t even live in the United States, let alone Utah, so your generalizations are at best ignorantly informed and at worst violent. Consider Utah as a foreign country. You don’t immediately understand the customs, and the people sometimes do weird stuff that makes you scared or angry. Outsiders have usually just been invaders (imagine how many Native Americans have felt), and so new folks coming in who don’t “get” the culture are either held in suspicion or outright contempt and judged accordingly. What do you do? You either adapt to those customs, keeping your own, trying to understand where they originate, or you stay miserable, marginalized yourself, by living there and not trying to understand it, or you take the third option and just move out. I’m opting for the third option. Maybe some of you would advocate a fourth option involving xenophobic genocide, but I wish you the worst and most painful misfortunes should you pursue that option.
    I’m making a sincere plea for you to stop judging us based on a little insanity in one very small state in the US. I believe all the doctrine of my Church. I’m not a heretic or apostate. I am 100% committed to my religion. That said, for the sake of my own mental health, I won’t be living in Utah much longer. If some of you folks following this want to be really magnanimous, an apology would be nice. Some of these comments have all but called for a genocide of LDS people, so it’s not really too much to ask. I’m offering an apology on behalf of members of my religion who have mistreated you.

    1. My impression is that many people in Utah are so used to judging each other they don’t even notice it anymore. It’s as normal (and almost just as expected) as talking about the weather. They act like it’s another form of small talk.

  99. Have lived in utah for 27 yrs, Mormons run the state, and what a fucked-up job they do!!!!!!!!!!! What’s realy said, is that they realy are not happy in their bull-shit, churh run lives. Uath has the dirtiest highways in the US. The cops are fucking cowards. Mormon women give good head, but not has good has mormon men. :) I have had a lot of Good head from Momons. :) SO see they are good for something. :) Please don’t judge me, its hard to tell the different between Mormon men and woman :) I’m just saying,…I bet Aaron gives good head. :)

  100. This is for Aaron (September 9, 2009 04:37 PM): Thank you for what you said. I’m not LDS, or native to Utah, and I’m guilty of slandering the culture here myself. Your post helped put a lot of healthy perspective on my own attitude towards the Utah culture.

  101. That was a pretty rational explanation of things Aaron, very good. Yet your tone was a bit non-apologetic in that “apology”(sensed that, but could be wrong). Regardless, you basically covered the Mormon perspective, which is only some of these posters’ complaint in the first place. What I mean is, this forum is about why UTAH sucks, not mormons, technically speaking. There have been too many anti-mormon comments here, I agree. Yet mormons are still very annoying to many people in general, you gotta admit. If enough people agree so emotionally on the same issue, there has to be some bit of truth to it. Ostracizing people is what they do, it’s a defense to their own desires. I understand, yet I think it’s an imperfected ideology because it cannot assimilate to other things, other things must assimilate to it. Not very Democratic if you ask me, but who cares, just leave me alone and it’s nothing. I think every person who chooses to worship their god in large financially fed groups are annoying, so that basically covers everyone anyways. When your beliefs are irrational, and you follow them very carefully, people tend to get annoyed very quickly. Outside of Utah, mormons are pretty cool though. The Mormon religion is not really the problem in Utah to me anyways, though it may have a part, it’s but a fraction of the rest.
    The point is, most of these people have lived in other places, and experienced other things. They came here, and their experiences where continually worse here in comparison to where they were previously at, so, the conclusion was, in general, Utah sucks. It makes complete sense to me.
    Only in Utah would an Air Force pilot “accidentally” unload his guns on 2 civilian cars in the desert injuring 2 other people on a “Practice Flight” with the explanation, “I looked into my goggles and everything just went wacky!” and then be excused. (They tried to totally avoid that one in the news BTW)
    xD
    Only in Utah (4 months or so later) would another Air Force pilot unload live munitions (bombs) in a civilian area because they accidentally triggered them whilst taking off (blowing up an ammunition shed in the process might I add). (Down the street from my house) ((yea, I feel REAL secure now!)) (((especially since they fly directly over my house 5 times a day in jets about 400ft up)))
    Thanks for the AWESOME building plan for Utah civil districts in general too! Airports over people’s houses, and shit tons of factories smashed in between SLC and Ogden creating a big smoggy cloud when the wind is calm in a big valley.
    “If you don’t like it, leave” – Famous Childish Utah Response
    “If you don’t like the Utah Sucks Ass Forum, YOU leave, and stfu on the way out, poser” – Famous Smartass Response

  102. “Utah has to be the shittiest place to live if you’re not a member of the Mormon church.” So, I want to move to Utah. I have read 50% of this page and I still want to move there. Snowboarding is my passion. I have seen the swiss/frensch alps and the rockies in CO. I want to experience the mountains in Utah, and what better way than to live there. Im not looking foward to the pollution. Why hate? or cry like a little bitch? Where ever you go there is going to be problems. So I have a few years left on my gi bill and I want my associates degree. I could move out there-work a shit job and go to school for two years while I ride once in awhile. I wont cuss anybody out for being different, I would rather get to know them and understand why. If it is ignorance and studpity then it is their problem and not mine. Maybe I will become mormon on the temp. and embrace it. Why not? See what its about from the inside. Its like saying you dont like broccoli becuase of the way it looks…try and you might love it. If you dont, then you know. Move on. Once I move on I may have been enlightened or maybe I will just end being other angry bitch ass like the rest of you. J….K

  103. When I originally wrote this post, I was in my early twenties and, admittedly, a bit naive about the world. A couple of years ago I wrote another blog entry (which you can read here) explaining how my opinion of Utah has changed over the years. It’s worth a read if you’ve already gotten this far into the comments.

  104. I’m not exactly sure why I’m posting this, but when I came across it, it made me understand the culture in Utah alot better than anything else I’ve ever found:
    “what is SO HARMFUL about being LDS?”
    From Kakan:
    Below, “Mormonism” refers to cultural and religious practices, wholeheartedly practiced with sincerity over long time periods. Impact is lessened for those less entangled or less sincere in their attempts to be perfect Mormons. These are assertions presented without support or data to keep the rant short.
    1) Mormonism stunts growth by denying people the opportunity to explore, practice and learn
    a) normal sexual exploration and personal standard development is denied
    b) normal emotional boundaries and preferences are not allowed expression
    c) normal spiritual exploration and doubts are rigidly repressed
    d) normal intellectual exploration is silenced by appeals to higher authority
    2) Mormonism creates rigid, defensive, judgmental personalities–painful to be and painful to be around
    3) Mormonism creates self-critical, perfectionist, self-hating personalities, who often then battle depression–very painful to be and painful to be around
    4) Mormonism creates obedient, submissive personalities who lose the ability to generate their lives on their own and seek guidance from outside for simple and intensely personal things, resulting in a sense of helplessness and disassociation from one’s own feelings and preferences. See stunted growth above.
    5) Mormonism encourages premature, inappropriate and inauthentic commitments, which creates enormous levels of guilt, shame and loss when the growing healthy soul finally begins to question those commitments and begins to dismantle them–or submit to living a shriveled, stunted, inauthentic life
    a) heterosexual marriage for gays and lesbians
    b) marriage for young people still learning who they are
    c) marriage for people who shouldn’t marry, or shouldn’t marry until later in life
    d) child-bearing/child-rearing for young people still half-formed themselves
    e) child-bearing/child-rearing for people who just don’t want/shouldn’t have kids, or not herds of kids
    6) Mormonism betrays its most sincere adherents, destroying their ability to trust and to relate, and taking from them unrecoverable years, energy and freedom. Because Mormonism is based on a false and misleading founding story/set of scriptures/principles for living a full life–those brave enough to question will eventually uncover the fraud and confront their unwitting losses. These individuals suffer a devastating sense of betrayal, often losing their ability to trust and connect to teachers, institutions, leaders and mates until the betrayal is understood and healed by time and insight. If this insight comes mid to late in life, lost opportunities, inappropriate commitments and other leftover baggage from one’s years as a Mormon must be grieved and let go–a necessary but often very painful process accompanied by bouts of rage and resentment…leading to problems in relationships with others that on the surface have nothing to do with Mormonism, but very much do.”

  105. I won’t generalize Utah as a whole, but in my personal experience most Mormons are the most shallow and backstabbing people I ever know. They smile in your face and do you wrong on your back. No wonder why mainstream America do not like them.
    Anon, hit the nail pretty well describing as to why they are the way they are. Many of them pretend and act out all their lives, yet live a different life inside doors.
    By the way I don’t hate them, but do not have any respect for them I must admit. I figured I will probably would like to kill myself if I was born in a strong Mormon family for which I have no personal desired to follow.

  106. Anon, what you posted was the most succinct description of Mormonism I’ve ever read anywhere, and certainly the most succinct on this site.
    Having been Mormon myself for just 5 years (I was converted in Belgium before choosing to come to what I thought would be the best place in the country; in Utah, among other Mormons), I can personally attest to the truth of what you posted. The strength with which Mormonism takes hold of you has to be felt to be believed, BUT, you never really feel it until you try to leave it. Because it takes hold of you so very gently and with everyone smiling.
    I still feel the damaging effects of having been a member a full 7 years after having left.
    Having said that, it’s not the religion that bothers me, although I have some very strong opinions against it (which Mormons usually explain away by saying that I fell to Satan’s temptations, thus instantly dismissing any rational arguments I may make after that), it’s the way the people are.
    Generally stupid, deeply but shyly racist (I’m arab, I would know), bigoted, narrow-minded and dishonest, both with themselves and other people.
    Now, although I think a lot of the people who posted here are wrong for placing the blame squarely on Mormonism, I VERY MUCH believe that there is a lot of truth to doing that.
    Here’s why.
    Having been Mormon in Belgium about as long as I was Mormon in Utah, I can assure anyone here who’s pro-Mormon that the same mentality of repression and shunning those who fall away exists well outside of Utah. Fortunately, not all aspects of this socially retarded state exist elsewhere, but the ones that matter do.
    HOWEVER…
    Anywhere outside of Utah, well… There’s way fewer Mormons. So if Mormons suddenly decide to shun you or otherwise separate themselves from you… It just doesn’t mean anything, because they’re the minority, so you still have a huge non-Mormon populous to socialize with.
    And that’s the other thing. I think I read this from someone else on here, and I tend to agree; there’s not much middle-ground in this state between Mormons and crazies.
    Which leaves us normal people with very little to associate with.
    Finally to the childish “omfg y dont u just leavez my awesom stayte!!!!” comments, don’t worry, all of us will eventually. I know I am.
    To New York City no less. Arguably one of the best cities in the country.
    But in the real world, you dumbasses, people with lives can’t just pack up and leave. I have a business presence to establish in NYC before jumping over there. It’s gonna take a couple of years, maybe more but hopefully less, and then I’m outta here.

  107. Wow, you people are getting really intense, don’t you think? I for one LOVE Utah. The people are the nicest I’ve ever seen, I love the church, I love everything about it.
    One thing everyone is complaining about is liqour. So, we don’t want our kids to get drunk. We don’t want teenagers having the influence. Is it a bad thing to ban alchohol? Think of all the destruction it has caused!
    And another thing, the cofee. Some people make fun of us for it. Here’s one thing… we knew not to smoke before it came out that it caused Cancer. Everyone made fun of us for that, then died of lung cancer!
    The people here are nice, and not hypocrites. You say we’re brainwashed? Are you really that dumb?! I suppose they used their “Evil mind powers” on us, did they? They laid it out, and it seemed to make sense. I am involved in the Church, and I cannot think of a more accepting community. You get invited to several meetings a week, you make new friends, everybody makes you feel welcome. If your looking for a place for acceptance, then look in the church!
    A lot of my best friends aren’t LDS, but that doesn’t stop me from not being friends with them. They understand that I believe in this, and I understand they don’t. Okay, that’s cool, that’s not going to stop us from hanging out.
    And bash on a entire STATE just because of the actions of a few individuals. You say we’re judgemental?
    You think we’re some kind of cult? What do we do that’s cultish? Yeah, we totally sacrfice babies and bathe in their blood, yeah, sure. No, we go to church for three hours. First hour is Sacrament. That’s basically like a mass, sort of. Next is bible study. We just talk about scriptures, (Usually in the bible), and discuss their meaning, and use lesson papers that are actually from a cathloic church not far away. Then is the quarum meeting, where sexes of the same age group meet together, discuss what they are going to do for the next week, assign duties to help out people in need, then have a short lesson. That’s church.
    Then on Monday it’s family home evening. A time where the entire family get’s together to play a board game, or watch a movie, while discussing… well, whatever they want! It’s a time to bond, and my family has gotten SO much closer because of it.
    I feel so accepted here, everybody is so nice. You know, if I have to be “brainwashed” to feel this good about myself, then sure! You people.. your lives are just horrible. You think cussing, drinking, and smoking will get you a good life? Judging an entire group of people is making YOU the judgemental ones.
    The schools are excellent. Great education system. So what if theres a church by my high school? They have no connection! We were persecuted by angry mobs and killed off… by people like you. We have finally found a place where we are accepted. Now you are trying to drive us out of here to? Can you people just accept mormons for who they are? Nice people who go to Church for three hours on a Sunday. We’re people just like you! The only difference is how we spend our time! We live on the same planet, breathe the same air. We are the same species… so why can’t we just get along?

    1. Dennis nailed it right on the head. You’re contradicting yourself with this “us vs. them” attitude.

      Mormon’s believe Utah was given to their religion by their god (or gods?), and they’re also the largest group in Utah, so there is an atmosphere of entitlement here. In a sense, anyone else is probably trespassing, and they either pass inspection or are pitied upon and, in some very common cases, stigmatized and treated like a leper. This seems very unique to many, many Utah Mormon communities, and I know it does not exactly reflect every Mormon community in and out of Utah.

      This entitlement can sometimes create a very judging, bitter, isolating atmosphere for people not from Utah and not Mormon–including me.

      I’m not judging your religion, Bryce. I kind of respect it for a lot of reasons. What I’m criticizing is the Mormon culture in general here in Utah.

      I say this from that “different” perspective Dennis is trying to open your mind up to see.

  108. Wow, Bryce. First you talk about feeling welcome, and the acceptance that is so freely given, then you make the statement, “We were persecuted by angry mobs and killed off… by people like you.”
    The whole “we” and “you” attitude is exactly what makes people feel unwelcome, and gives an air of unacceptance (that’s a word, right?). Of course you feel welcome among church members, since you share many of the same beliefs and ideas. Just try thinking about it from a different perspective, and you may just see why others don’t feel the same way as you…

  109. Overheard this at a library in Utah County between two returned Mormon missionaries: “You want to be careful because we’re a cult, and we have power.”
    I’ve never had a problem with their religion, but their culture . . .

  110. Honestly speaking, I’ve never been to a more disadvantaged area in my life until now. I was even in Galveston during Ike! When I went to this thrift store…D.I. I think it was, there was some sort of special going on and when I walked to the door, a mad stopped me to ask if I was a member of the church. when I asked which church he meant, he instantly became uncomfortable and I was asked to leave! I just wanted a pair of shoes for my brother! I really don’t understand this place at all. Also my back windshield got shot out while I was driving in north Ogden while listening to “Miss Moon”…I’m glad I have my Wolf mixes keeping these nuts outta my yard here…I can’t even get assistance here without going through so much paperwork and verifying and the run-a-round crap! Also, I almost had to sue a few of the Dr.’s here because they were not willing to work on a Hermaphrodite…most didn’t even know what I was and I got called a sin from god behind my back when they left my patient room and forgot to shut the door. I have no where else to go so I’m more or less stuck here…with my FEMALE fiancee…any suggestions on how to deal with it?

  111. I grew up in American Fork, Utah. My sixth grade class had only two Jehovah Witnesses and the rest of us were you guessed it… Woohoo I learned all about culteral diversity at a very young age, not!! I actually learned that I was in the only true church on the face of the planet and to feel sorry for everyone else. That being said, I am now an adult who is a proud atheist and my children are given the choice to choose for themselves. Oops I grew up mormon but I have a high IQ, Utah is polluted,they do little about recycling and Vernal has ozone levels to match Los Angeles. If you prefer coffee over tea bags, don’t say anything unless you like sugar in your gas tank. Teenagers dress like hookers here and the whole town is on either meth or heroin or oxycontin/ pills and the doctors here google your diagnosis… Yyes I am in the process of leaving because we are going to eventually get hit by a texting trophy wife in her hummer… I miss colorado

    1. They start ‘em dressing like hookers young apparently. When I saw a girl approximately 6 years old wearing knee high boots with heels on them, I knew something was not quite right. Guess she’s gotta catch that perfect husband to get her soccer team of children going when she hits 17. What better way than to start sexualizing them early and then condemn them for the very thing that they are inadvertently instilling in them….

  112. All the chicks here dress like hookers.
    If they aren’t mormon they try to be anti-mormon… and there is no way that these 13 year olds have that big of boobs! Its like they are immature, short, and have the bust of a 25 year old.
    Its no wonder there is so many pedophiles here. o_o

  113. Many Mormon people in Utah seem very brainwashed. They don’t think for themselves and their whole world revolves around their religion. They don’t look at or try to unnderstand anything more than three feet in front of them. Very closed-minded and judgemental. Seem to be threatened or intimidated by individuality and diversity.

    I moved here to Utah (without knowing any better) to go to school, and I was sitting next to two returned Mormon missionaries in class one day. One was talking about her new boyfriend who was a Baptist and had just moved to Utah. The other missionary freaked out and asked, “What’s he doing in Utah, then?” The other responded without any hesitation, “Oh, I know, we’re trying to convert him as soon as possible.”

  114. It’s not just the state of Utah it’s are whole fucked up Country it caters to Spanish Language if you don’t speak English well what about German,French r any other Language to speak of This fucked up US- of- assholes don’t give a shit about the rest of none English Speaking people than IF YOU were a drug addict and got arrested for a simple drug possession and now you are clean and are trying to be a part of this society in the work force Big and little Company’s and also the Insurance Company’s Don’t want to give that person a break when the have changed their life’s around so when they finely get tired of trying and get no were most will more than likely just give up and turn back to their old life styles so wake up people it’s time to take back from the new world order the System took away my LAND AND Freedom a long time ago

  115. Utah is a a scary place if your not Mormon. Word of advice detour around this state! You may end up in jail and be brought up on trumped up charges in front of a Mormon judge! Salt Lake City is a joke, forget Las Vegas and the mob…..The Mormon mob in Salt Lake City is like non other.

    1. I concur. The only reason we went to that God Forsaken hovel was to handle my fiance’s trumped up charges from years ago. Utah seems to be very keen on kid-knapping people and not letting them leave. You’d think that since they are so scared of “outsiders” that they wouldn’t want to keep them there, but they do. I think they do it to try to break them down so that they eventually accept help from the Mormons, and everyone knows that if you ever accept their help, they own you. Badaboom, badabing, they have then recruited another into their cult. So what that it was because they really didn’t have a choice? Horrible, Horrible, place. Drive around that shit hole. NEVER go to Utah to for any reason!

  116. I visited Utah recently and I can honestly say that everything that you say about that state is true. The state itself is pretty with it’s snow capped mountains (when a veritable blanket of smog isn’t hindering them from being seen), but the people? Oh my GOD the fucking people. Where do I even start? These “people”, if you can call them that, are straight up asswads. I, personally am convinced that Utah is, in fact, where the mother ship will land to retrieve all the Morman assholes that infest Utah, like a human scourge. Bigoted doesn’t even scratch the surface of how to describe these people. They have weird laws, and every woman there is pregnant by 17 with at least 4 little crumb snatchers traipsing behind her. I got to witness “family night” in Layton at the Golden Corral. I. Was. TERRIFIED. First off, if you are not blonde, blue-eyed, and morman you WILL be stared at. And I don’t mean a fleeting curious glance. I’m talking a full on slack-jawed, glassy eyed, scrutinous stare. Our table got what can only be described as “baby bombed” by some random ass waitress who for whatever reason, decided it would be a grand idea to stop at our table comprised of a group of people who felt like we had stepped into the damn twilight zone, and ask us how cute we thought some tiny screaming small dragon (who for some reason was wearing hooker boots at the ripe old age of 6) was. I just looked at her and told her that no one at our table was interested in, or even liked kids. You would have thought I said that we should bomb an orphanage or some shit. She just looked amazed as her tiny brain tried to process the fact that there were actually people out there who didn’t give a shit about random stranger’s mormon spawn. The best part about our trip to Utah was the speed with which we were able to flee it since the speed limit is 80mph. If I ever have to go anywhere that requires me to go through Utah, I just might have to decline going. What a hovel of a state. Seriously.

  117. Based on the comments posted I can only presume most of the posters here have little more than a 9th grade education. Your spelling, grammar and syntax is atrocious. It’s obvious you all lack command of the English language. Those who use fuck as adverbs, nouns, and adverbs don’t come across as articulate. Perhaps you should all move out of Utah, obtain an education, and learn to not be so close minded. Recent statistics show the state’s Mormon population at less than 50%. I’ve lived in AZ, and CO. While there are differences and quirks here compared to the aforementioned states there are some great qualities in the Mormon’s. The posters here are likely young, have not had much life experience, and need only time to mature.

    1. Speaking of life experiences, how many of Utah’s LDS members do you think have lived outside of Utah? Being on a mission doesn’t count. I would say not many. If they did, they would realize how backwards and antiquated this state is compared to other states. Next….being closed minded…..let see….I don’t even know where to begin with that one, I’ve lived in MANY states and regions, the south, mid-west and others. I’ve encountered closed mindedness in the south, but it is nowhere close to what I’ve experienced in Utah. People here have NO concept of culture nor diversity. Great qualities in the mormons?? LIKE WHAT??? In my own neighborhood my kids aren’t invited to events because we aren’t LDS….they are outcast because they don’t attend church, my family has been brushed aside because we’re not part of the church. When at the park, while conversing with other parents and they learn we aren’t LDS, they stop in mid conversation and walk away. If you want a PERFECT example of close mindedness, being in Utah is where you’ll find it.

      Your comment about the education of posters is a perfect example of your LACK of life experience. Its clear you haven’t experienced a population with a true lack of education, nor have you any true life experience. So, before you decide to critique the syntax and usage of the English language by others, make sure you have something other than empty ideas and thoughts to use.

  118. Wow, a bunch of Mormon & Utah haters. What a waste of spece this blog is. Mormons are good people. Yes many of them (usually the older ones) are closed-minded, but most really help out. They are Christian unlike many who post of this page. As for the guy who left a $40K a yr job to go be unemployed, shows how ignorant you are. Probably voted for Obama and look where that got you. On food stamps too? Way to contribute to society. More like leach off of it. At least Mormons do their part for community and hold up Christian values. Not much can be said for other Christian faiths, including my own. Quit hating on people of other faiths, be more like Christ.

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